Saudi Army Camel Tongue Rank Fobs Worn by US Military

[ehrentitle]

I've started a tread to on these unusual Saudi ranks in the hopes that others can help to shed more light on the topic. In recent months I've become obsessed with the Saudi Army "Camel Tongue" rank fobs worn by us service members in Saudi Arabia. These fobs were worn by US military advisors at least since the late 1970s as well as during and after Desert Storm by military personnel who had frequent contact with the Saudi military.

 

Not only are they difficult to find, I've spent nearly a decade looking for them and have found 10, but information on them is also limited. The only real source of information on then is this thread started in 2010 here on the USMF: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/66878-saudi-rank-for-us-brigadier-general

 

After acquiring several different samples I believe there are four distinct versions of these fobs. They would normally be worn on the inside button of the upper right pocket of the 6-color and later the 3 color desert uniform. For advisors stationed in Saudi Arabia these were also worn on occasion on the dress uniform. Starting from left to right in the photo below:

 

 

Dark brown "pleather" Desert Storm era imitation leather fobs with silver or gold Saudi military rank insignia above a two piece hat badge. I believe, but cannot confirm, that at one time these were also worn by the United States Military Training Mission (USMTM) in Saudi Arabia (see below). These came in silver and gold rank versions. One school of thought is that the silver was for the Air Force and Gold for the Army, however it appears that whatever was available was worn. There are also variations on the bottom of the fob, some are rounded others are square. That difference could simply be caused by who made them. I don't know how long these were worn, however due to Operation Southern Watch which continued for almost a decade form 1992 to 2003 they could have been worn for over a decade after Desert Storm. There are four enlisted ranks on the far left and a Saudi Arabian 1st Lieutenant rank shown in the photo below.

 

Dark brown "pleather" imitation leather fob with the metal U.S.M.T.M Saudi Arabia device was worn by the United States Military Training Mission (USMTM) in Saudi Arabia which provides advisors to the regular Saudi Army. It's been in existence since the 1950s, however it's thought that the fobs in different forms have been worn since the late 1970s. This is a joint organization so the fob was worn by the Army, Navy/Marines and Air Force. The example below is Saudi Major rank over the metal USMTM symbol. After the ACU was fielded these were made in ACU fabric for the Army as well as the fabric of the cammo uniforms for the other services. The metal USMTM device has also been observed on these ACU fobs. I'm not sure what's worn on the Multicam uniform, however I've seen at least one photo showing the "pleather" fob secured under the Multicam name tape.

 

Light brown real leather fob (on the far right) was worn by the US Army Office of the Program Manager-Saudi Arabian National Guard Modernization Program (OPM-SANG) which provides advisors to the Saudi National Guard. At the bottom of the fob is a gold Saudi National Guard emblem and above it in this example is subdued Saudi Lieutenant Colonel rank. To have a mix of subdued and gold insignia seems counter intuitive but apparently it's done by tradition. This is an Army only organization and after the ACU was fielded these fobs were made in ACU fabric with the gold Saudi National Guard emblem pinned at the bottom.

 

For both the USMTM and OPM-SANG the ACU with it's slanted pocket and no buttons presented a problem as there was no place to button the fob. So the fabric ACU fobs were designed to velcro under the name tape.

 

Once the Multicam uniform was fielded in OPM-SANG I've started to see an indication that the fob is starting to be replaced with a rectangular Multicam patch velcrowed to the flap of the left arm pocket. It appears to have the Saudi National Guard symbol on the left and the Saudi rank on the right of the patch as seen below.

 

 

There are also a couple of intriguing photos from early in Desert Storm showing General Schwarzkopf and his generals wearing a variety of the brown and tan fobs. General Schwarzkopf's appears unique, since it only displays the subdued Saudi rank of General on a russet brown fob. I believe limited availability at the time may have caused this wide variation in fobs:

 

 

 

[ehrentitle]

I'd been told that it was less likely to see an Airman wearing these fobs, at least after Desert Storm. Here is a good example of a US Military Training Mission (USMTM) fob being worn on DCUs by a Senior Master Sergeant (E-8) 2004-05. I believe the horizontal bar represents senior NCOs E-9, however I've also seen a vertical version of it worn by US Warrant Officers since the Saudis have no warrant officer rank.

 

 

It's interesting that he is wearing this Saudi rank since the Saudi Arabia Country Study published in 1992 shows a different rank equivalency for Air Force Senior Master Sergeant:

[mvmhm]

I wore one when I was in SOUTHERN WATCH from July to December 1998...we were assigned to Eskan Village and only those of us on the C6/J6 Staff were allowed to wear them...

 

 

Mark sends

[ehrentitle]

I wore one when I was in SOUTHERN WATCH from July to December 1998...we were assigned to Eskan Village and only those of us on the C6/J6 Staff were allowed to wear them...

 

 

Mark sends

 

Thanks Mark, Do you still have the fob still or any photos of it being worn? Eskan Village in Riyadh is also where USMTM and OPM-SANG have been stationed since 1991. Kevin

[lettow]

I was issued one when assigned to the CENTCOM JISE at Eskan Village in 1998 but we never had occasion to wear them.

[ehrentitle]

I was issued one when assigned to the CENTCOM JISE at Eskan Village in 1998 but we never had occasion to wear them.

 

Lettow, Thanks, If you still have have it I'd be interested in seeing what it looks like. Kevin

 

[ScottG]

Kevin, I have a set from Qatar that basically serve the same purpose. They were Qatari shoulder ranks that were issued to US troops at Camp Doha during OIF. The enlisted styles have a button loop for wear on the DCU, the officers are all just shoulder ranks. Scott

[ehrentitle]

Kevin, I have a set from Qatar that basically serve the same purpose. They were Qatari shoulder ranks that were issued to US troops at Camp Doha during OIF. The enlisted styles have a button loop for wear on the DCU, the officers are all just shoulder ranks. Scott

 

Scott, Thanks, do you have photos? I'd be interested to see what these look like. Kevin

 

[ScottG]

Here are some Kevin, as I said they came from the US clothing issue facility (CIF) at Camp Doha in 2003. I went there to get a few sets of extra DCU's while I was on r &r from Iraq and I saw a box of these. Many of them were singles with the button tab attached. I looked for pairs so I only have the one given to me for wear with the button tab still intact. They are not as fancy as the Saudi versions, but they do represent much lower ranks as well as senior officers. I was never required to wear one as I wasn't part of the Camp Doha garrison, but when I received my clothes issue, the civilian placed the one with the tab attached into my clothing bag? Enjoy! Scott.

[ehrentitle]

Scott, very cool, thanks for sharing! Kevin

[Frank Allen]

Good Evening Mr. Ehrentitle,

I was assigned to Saudi Arabia, pre-war, in 1985-1986. I worked in USMTM, it was the best tour in my career. We were the fob in the attached photograph. Of which I am searching feverishly trying to find one. My fob was lost when the hurricane flooded our home. They are very hard to find. I saw one in a two year period and put a very high safe bid on it and the guy who bought it waited till one minute before the auction ended and bid one penny more than me before I could respond the auction was over. My family has bought me a shadow box and since I have become disabled and my friends, with whom I have remained close to for more than thirty years, have begin to die, this is even more important to me.

If you come across one that is for sale, please keep me in mind. My email address is [email protected]

Thank you

Frank

 

 

 

 

[FatTire]

Just to add a little more to the thread, these are more recent versions of the fobs in USAF ABU pattern. One is for the 64th AEG and the other is USMTM. Both display Saudi military ranks. I've obscured the name in Arabic on the one on the right.

 

Ben

[ehrentitle]

Ben, Those are some great finds, real keepers. I'd never seen the 64th Air Expeditionary Group (AEG) version before. It looks like the unit was inactivated in 2014: http://www.afcent.af.mil/Units/379th-Air-Expeditionary-Wing/News/Display/Article/501563/64th-air-expeditionary-group-deactivated/

[FatTire]

Thanks Kevin. Here are a few more relatively recent versions of the Saudi fobs for the US Army in ACU camo. The one on the left is for USMTM, and the one on the right is a slightly older version for OPM SANG.

 

Ben

[FatTire]

One more type of Saudi fobs in OCP/Multicam. The one on the left is for a Captain with USMTM. The one on the right is for a Lt Col with OPM SANG.

 

Ben

[FatTire]

It has taken some time, but I was finally able to get a OCP/Multicam pocket patch for a CW3 with the US Army OPM-SANG. These replaced the leather/pleather or cloth pocket fobs which had the metal SANG insignia on them. They also exist in ACU pattern.

[ehrentitle]

It's taken me some years, but I've finally gotten representative examples of Saudi rank patches (Colonel) in OPC from the USMTM, OPM-SANG, and MOI-MAG. Kevin

[FatTire]

Really nice set of rare OCP patches. The USMTM patch is one style that I hadnt seen yet. I wonder if that particular USMTM patch was also made in the ACU pattern or if it came out after the ACUs had been pretty much phased out? Ben

[walt323]

Here is one from an Air Force Colonel

[TheCarDemotic]

I’m a bit late, but I was fortunate to have found one in a box of stuff my father gave me. He wore it in 1998 when he was a Captain in Army Central Command. He was in Saudi in 1998.

 

Also somewhat off topic but chose to include the only other item I have of his from Saudi. A 3 Color Desert Boonie with captain rank sewn onto it.

[ehrentitle]

That's a very nice example of a Captain's rank fob.  Thanks for sharing.

[Unicorn]

I think I only ever saw a couple of those in person. I was stuck at Eskan doing force protection in 2005.

[S.ChrisKelly]

This one was mine, circa 1993:

 

[ehrentitle]

Very nice silver “Air Force” style fob, thanks for sharing!

[S.ChrisKelly]

"Camel Tongue", Saudi Lieutenant Colonel, given to me by the USAF officer who wore it, circa 1991.