Interesting Medal Bar - Medal & Research Experts - Who Is It To & What Do You Think?

[Frank_Smith]

As I continue to go through this old collection that I have been asked to liquidate, I'm finding some interesting things including this bar.

All of the medals are fairly early strikes that date from the late 1940's to early 1970's. The seven medals include a Legion of Merit with 2/OLC, 2/Stars, and combat "V", Joint Services Commendation Medal with OLC and Star, Army Commendation Medal with OLC and combat "V", American Campaign, Asiatic-Pacific Campaign with 3/stars and a USMC device, WWII Victory and a National Defense Medal. The LOM has the initials "L.P.J." and the Army Commendation is named "L. P. JONES". The bar on which they are mounted appears British.

My gut tells me that it’s "right" just unusual. Has anyone ever seen anything like this? Can any of you master researchers figure out who it is to?

[Frank_Smith]

Picture #2

[Frank_Smith]

Last one.

[Dave]

Off the bat, I'm going to assume it's Navy due to the FMF device. That could be totally erroneous, but with the stars, I'm guessing it is a good start. I'd also start looking for medical personnel...could be a chaplain, but my hunch would be medical. I am going to assume he was an officer in WW2 by the lack of a Good Conduct, but that's also not entirely impossible. So, based on all that, as of mid-1944, the following L. P. Jones were around:

 

Laurie P. DOB 1921

Lewis P. DOB 1916

 

Pretty slim pickins, really. Now, those names are based on a bunch of assumptions, so they could very likely not be the right guy, so anything is possible at this point.

 

Checking one other reference, there's a Lloyd P. DOB 1923 in my 1972 retired register. He retired as a LT 1619, so I'm assuming it's not him, but you never know.

 

No solutions yet, obviously, but I'll look into it as time allows later today...

[kanemono]

Dave,

Isn't that a EGA on the Pacific campaign medal?

Dick

[Dave]

Dave,

Isn't that a EGA on the Pacific campaign medal?

Dick

 

Yes...the FMF device...which would lead me to believe he was a Navy officer.

[joeclown]

Stars and OLCs seems an odd mixture

[Dave]

Stars and OLCs seems an odd mixture

 

Not if he was serving in joint billets. My hunch has me going down the track of a medical officer who served jointly for much of his career.

 

I could be totally wrong, but in the absence of anything else...it's a way to go.

[Dave]

Though looking at it again, he shouldn't have a star on the JSCM, so that one is definitely wrong...

[Frank_Smith]

Dave:

 

Finding problems with the bar doesn't hurt my feelings in the least. I wanted comments and help with the set.

 

I've seen groups with a combination of second award stars and OLC's before; just not this many. My first take was that he was a Navy medical guy attached to the Marines in the Pacific. He must have been a junior officer or promoted to officer before he qualified for a Good Conduct Medal. Remaining in the service and serving in a joint capacity or facility with the Army on several occasions, he made it to the rank of Captain or Rear Admiral before retirement. He might have been awarded a DSM after retirement; hence it is not on the bar.

 

As for the medals and bar itself, it looked much better than other "humped" up groups that I've seen. I liked the strikes of the medals. The WWII campaigns are period pieces and the JSCM and ARCOM aren't new. The LOM appears to be a late 1960's or early 1970's manufactured piece. That would make sense for a career officer who mounted up his original issues. The wear on the medals also looks good. You can match up wear spots on the backs of the medals (like the ARCOM and JSCM) from rubbing against one another. This is the same with the campaign medals. A group that was sewn up and put on a bar and thrown in a riker mount wouldn't have these characteristics.

 

I've also seen many LOM's engraved with just initials (primarily from the Army and Air Force) and the engraving on the ARCOM and LOM doesn't look like it has been done recently.

 

Anyway, this is an odd bird. It might have been enhanced, but who in the heck who have spent the money to get it professionally mounted with no research with this combination of awards. I checked out some registers last night and didn't find anyone that I could say "ah-hah" to, but I'm still hoping to prove it right or wrong one way or another. One thing is for sure, it is a conversation piece.

 

Frank

[KurtA]

The thing I mainly find odd is that long (looks British) pin back assembly. Having a US medal bar from the VN (or later ) era with other than clutch posts for a means of affixing is rather unusual. Seems like something a collector would do more so than a Naval officer who would wear it.

But, anything is possible and other than that, the group just doesn't scream "made up" to me. Just weird enough to be legit.

Odd there is no 2nd award device on the National Defense, but based on all the stuff on the other ribbons, perhaps he probably ran out of hardware before he got all the way to the right?

[Dave]

My quick search on the three names came up empty. Hmmm...

 

One thing I did notice on the bar is that it appears that the medals haven't been on there too long. It looks to me that they still maintain the fold where they were individually mounted at one point. I wonder if the previous owner got these from a collector who might have assembled them from individual medals? If that's the case, there might be a medal or two that's missing, and that could be throwing the whole thing off.

 

Just brainstorming at this point!

[lettow]

I think he was WWII Navy and post war Army.

 

If he were only in the Navy, the multiple awards of the ARCOM would mean that he was tasked on two occasions to Army units. I don't know how likely that is.

 

The reason for the oak leaves and the stars depends on what uniform he decided to put them on after he was out of service.

 

There may be a considerable gap in service with the NDSM being for Vietnam era service and he was not in service during Korea. The JSCM was not authorized until 1963 so he was in service after then accounting for the NDSM during Vietnam era service.

[Kaigun Shosa]

Don't forget that each branch had official medal mounting configurations as well. I would assume this mounted early 1970's and that:

 

Navy personnel are allowed to wear three medals side by side or mount up to five (overlapping) medals per one row,

 

Marines are authorized to wear four medals side by side or up to seven medals overlapping per one row.

 

Army regs indicate that "medals worn in a row will not overlap"

 

The selection of these particular medals do not make sense. With a LoM, and Ar-Com with combat "V" and a J-Com would make one assume that this individual would have done Joint service in the early 1960's and with a new Joint Commendation medal introduced in 1963, regulations may have been unclear as to multiple awards at the time with both OLC's and Gold Star awarded by multiple branches indicated on the medal. (assumption)

Also, the lack of other campaign medals, Korea? Vietnam? Surly the Vet would have worn or mounted these as well?

What campaigns were the combat "V" earned? In this particular group you see the army style bronze colored "V" awards, while in the 1960's and early 70's the Navy and Marine Corps combat "V" was a gold colored "V". (Pictured below).

 

So to me, I would assume that this is a made up, post service bar with the selection, by the Vet, of the medals they wanted to wear. So we are left with the question of how, what, when and why.

 

[Kadet]

One point of clarification on the stars and oak leaves. Although multiple awards of joint decorations are signified by an oak leaf regardless of service branch, the LOM Is a Service specific award and is not awarded for joint actions. Therefore it would never be appropriate for a Sailor or Marine to wear one with an oak leaf unless they served in the Army or AF or it was awarded by the Army or AF. If the medals are accurate, the recipient was awarded both the Army and Navy versions of the LOM

[Hermanus]

Any luck with the research? Found a match yet?

[Hermanus]

Any news?

[12A54]

I’ll weigh in. It’s a Navy bar - short ribbons, overlap, V on LOM, fleet device, stars. Bottom line - when it was made and after all these medals had been earned, this person was Navy.

 

But: How does one receive 2-3 Legions of Merit from the Army (or Air Force), AND 2-3 from the Navy (with one being for valor) for a total of 5?

 

And how does the same person get 2 ARMY Commendation Medals with a combat V on a bar that only indicates WWII combat?

 

Add multiple Joint Service Commendations from both Army (or Air Force) and Navy - a medal introduced in the 1960s.

 

Nothing about this bar makes any sense to me.

[USMCR79]

I once owned this many years ago and it left me dazed and confused!!

 

Bill