ID'd MACV-SOG Recon 1-Zero Vest

[warpath]

MACV-SOG Recon One-Zero Vest...Another closet find...Marin has seen this one. Ed

[warpath]

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[warpath]

2

[doyler]

Outstanding.

[63 RECON]

rad stuff as always, I'm digging the sewn tapes

[Patchcollector]

Would this have been worn on "over the fence" missions with the nametape and "US Army" tape on it?

[warpath]

In this case, yes. I have seen only a couple named or badged vests.Ed

[Spy vs Spy]

Yes Ed I remember, that is a beauty.

 

Best

Martin

[Patchcollector]

From what I've read I've always believed that all items used on cross border missions were to be "sterile"; unmarked so as to afford deniability in case a Team member was captured or killed.

 

 

Seeking to learn more,I emailed Maj. John L. Plaster, U.S. Army (Ret.),sending him a link to this thread so that he could view it and I asked if he would please comment.

 

 

Here is his reply:

 

 

Your email was forwarded to me.

You are correct. A vest having these patches would never have been taken on a cross-border operation.

The only vests I ever saw used by recon personnel were designed to hold 40mm rounds for grenade launchers – and they had no identification.

JOHN PLASTER

[vintageproductions]

I find that as an odd answer from Plaster as I thought he was the one who designed these 1-0 vests.

 

Ed, that is a killer vest and neat to see the strips on it.

[Patchcollector]

I inquired of "Mr." Plaster because I feel that there is no one on this planet that is more qualified to comment on what was worn(or not worn) on cross border missions than him.I respect Mr.Plaster immensely and am grateful that he took the time to answer my question.

 

Here is some info from an article that he recently wrote:

 

 

Covert Warriors
by Maj. John L. Plaster, U.S. Army (Ret.) - Friday, April 3, 2015

 

Deniability
"Since Hanoi insisted it had no troops in “neutral” Laos or Cambodia, the United States, too, denied that SOG operations were underway. To support this deniability, recon teams were required to go “sterile”—meaning no ID or dog tags, unmarked or non-U.S. uniforms, and unattributable arms. Thus, SOG’s armory stocked many foreign firearms with which a team leader armed his men according to how he saw fit to accomplish each mission.

 

By 1967, the enemy had captured enough U.S. weapons in South Vietnam that weapon deniability was relaxed for missions into Laos, although the requirement continued another two years for Cambodia."

 

Weapon restrictions were relaxed,but I do not believe that the requirement that nothing ID'ing the Team member was ever changed.

 

Here is a link to the site where I found this info:

 

 

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2015/4/3/behind-enemy-lines-weapons-of-vietnams-covert-warriors/

[Beau-Brummel]

I think It was Lynn Black who had a hand In designing these Bob.

 

To be fair to the previous poster I'm rather sceptical as well that this would have been worn over the wire; however one must remember that there are pictures of these vests worn at Khe Sahn during the siege and If that doesn't qualify as combat wear I'm not sure what does. As we all know memory Is a funny old thing and the vet may have been referring to any number of situations If he said he wore It on op's.

 

Best Regards, Guy.

I find that as an odd answer from Plaster as I thought he was the one who designed these 1-0 vests.

 

Ed, that is a killer vest and neat to see the strips on it.

[Patchcollector]

Yes,since Khe Sanh was "incountry",there would be no problem with wearing the tapes on uniforms,vests,etc..

[Jason_Hardy]

I know Sammy personal and believe he did not retire until the 1990s. With that said, funding for Special Forces really tightened after Vietnam and there was not allot of money for reequipping or research and development of the teams. Allot of veterans I know who stayed in the service worn items they had remaining from South East Asia, hell the stuff was made to last.

 

I really think some collectors have a tendency to over think things sometimes.

[Jason_Hardy]

I find that as an odd answer from Plaster as I thought he was the one who designed these 1-0 vests.

 

Ed, that is a killer vest and neat to see the strips on it.

 

I think you are referring to the Norwegian Mr. Fishing vest story claiming Lynne Black the author of Whiskey Tango Foxtrot (KFC) designed the vest. Black served in Vietnam with MAC V SOG in 1967-1968.

 

I have purchased two vest from veteran's who served at Camp Long Thanh in 1965. I believe they wore originally designed and issued to the early Vietnamese teams that jumped into North Vietnam.

 

Jason Hardy

[Patchcollector]

Good info Jason.That the tapes were sewn on postwar,or; that the tapes were sewn on during the war and the vest was worn incountry seems to me to be the best possibilities.

[doyler]

I echo what Jason and Guy stated. Many were multi tour or post war vets and would carry over the items they had. Practical men and used what they had. Im sure Mr.Plasters memories are accurate but if you have ever spoken to vets there are no two recollections the same and depending on where and what time frame they served equipment will change and vary....unit to unit/person to person. I have had the opportunity to meet and speak with a vet this summer who was on SOG's staff as a mission planner and under Gen Singlaub.Knew him very well..He was recruited into the job after a manual he wrote caught the attention of some of the higher ups.Very intresting individual.Two tour vet and he has great insight into SOG and the workings.He also knew a lot of the operators personally.He had several stories on Jerry Shriver....Called him "The Natural" and the best of the best.

[e19]

I just talked with an old SF teammate who ran recon out of CCN, and he agrees with Plaster on the use of sterile on SOG missions. He also agreed with the vests being made to hold grenade rounds.

[doyler]

I agree they were used/designed for 40mm grenades or designed to hold them.Very common for Teams to carry a M79 or a chopped one as seen in pictures or the early under barrel launchers.Added much needed firepower.

 

Thinking the tropical survival kit would also fit in the pouches if needed.

 

Here is an early SEAL float coat I have in the Grenadiers style.Note the similiar pocket style designed for grenades.I sure other items were or could be carried as the grenades were a lot of weight if you filled all he pockets on this jacket.

 

[doyler]

An odd modified C1 AF survivl vest I picked up with some tigers.Doesnt appear used

 

[Jason_Hardy]

I have encountered two styles of the 1-0 vest, the first is a lighter weight canvas material that has a sewn in leather holster. The second version is like the one that started this forum. This style I have seen in a couple different colors and have been privileged to own about a dozen over the years. I have two that the veterans they claimed to have set them up (stocked) themselves with a compass, map, pen flair set and other survival items. I do not believe the vest would be very practical for M-79 rounds.

[Beau-Brummel]

I have encountered two styles of the 1-0 vest, the first is a lighter weight canvas material that has a sewn in leather holster. The second version is like the one that started this forum. This style I have seen in a couple different colors and have been privileged to own about a dozen over the years. I have two that the veterans they claimed to have set them up (stocked) themselves with a compass, map, pen flair set and other survival items. I do not believe the vest would be very practical for M-79 rounds.

 

Yes, I've seen that early one, very Interesting piece!

[Spy vs Spy]

I have encountered two styles of the 1-0 vest, the first is a lighter weight canvas material that has a sewn in leather holster. The second version is like the one that started this forum. This style I have seen in a couple different colors and have been privileged to own about a dozen over the years. I have two that the veterans they claimed to have set them up (stocked) themselves with a compass, map, pen flair set and other survival items. I do not believe the vest would be very practical for M-79 rounds.

Jason, I believe you have shown me both of theses two versions last time I visited. But aren't they also pictured in one of your books? Or am I thinking of what you might have shown in a not yet published volume?

 

Best

Martin

[warpath]

Early vest with holster circa 1963

[Spy vs Spy]

Very nice photo Ed. Many interesting details.

 

Best

Martin