Ronny67 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #51 Posted October 27, 2016 Lets look at the hardware on these straps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronny67 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #52 Posted October 27, 2016 No wear from use, almost 100 percent finish, and no age. The lips of the hook look to have the coppery sheen of repro parts. Again, very fuzzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronny67 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #53 Posted October 27, 2016 A look at the chinstrap where it meets the loop. Original chinstraps, even unissued ones, have "formed" to the loop they have been sewn to for 70 years. These chinstraps have not been on these loops long, and have no fit to the metal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronny67 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #54 Posted October 27, 2016 Again, look at the fuzz. Just not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronny67 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #55 Posted October 27, 2016 So, if this helmet came from where OP says, than the veteran had it made for him, or his family had it made. But this helmet shows very real attempts to look older, and look like an original. So that makes me doubt the story completely. I also don't like how OP is not accepting what we are telling him. If he knew how rare these helmets are in this condition, he would have been sceptical before posting it here. However I sense a corner, and someone backed into it. R67 OUT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted October 27, 2016 Share #56 Posted October 27, 2016 The OP stated the officer was KIA.This is verifiable in several ways.Just saying there wouldnt be a need for a veteran to have one made or the family of a KIA.Doesnt make sense to me.We also dont know what the OP gave or paid for the items and it hasn't been discussed if the family was cashing in on a rare helmet.Did they know or even care it was an M2.....Im guessing they didnt? We had a few 101st vets here who would wear repo jump suits and even helmets for parades when riding in a jeep but these were your typical 70s and 80s surplus store fair even a couple with airborne liners.Seen other vets wi th helmets as well painted and unpainted but never seen one here where a vet was going for the "real, correct or original" look to the point they sought out and had one duplicated.They just wanted a helmet...they didnt care.I asked one locally if he wanted a WW2 vintage helmet or a darker paint on his helmet.He replied "why?I have one just like I wore already".I couldnt argue with that logic and why explain something to him that obviously didnt matter to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted October 27, 2016 Share #57 Posted October 27, 2016 Also isnt there some magic number thats accepted for the width of the loops at the base where attached both inside and out side of the feet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king802 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #58 Posted October 27, 2016 Again, look at the fuzz. Just not right. Those chinstraps are original. Maybe not original to that helmet but without a doubt original chinstraps. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkash23686 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #59 Posted October 27, 2016 Those chinstraps are original. Maybe not original to that helmet but without a doubt original chinstraps. Rich With everything else thats not quite right on that helmet I would personally want to see the other side of the button and look for a makers mark. You can still obtain these snaps only difference being the makers mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted October 27, 2016 Share #60 Posted October 27, 2016 Those chinstraps are original. Maybe not original to that helmet but without a doubt original chinstraps. Rich I agree, they look 100% original to me. The lack of dirt in the area where the two straps meet is seen on most straps. It's just an area that's been protectected between the two straps meet so no dirt collects there. They do have fuzz but that little fuzz looks normal, repro straps have a much more fuzzy look than that. Definitely an odd helmet, the straps look good and I think the bales have a chance, but if both those things are good then why the far off heat stamp? -Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king802 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #61 Posted October 27, 2016 Original NOS chinstrap material can still be found. Gary Underhill had quite a bit a few years ago. When I said original I meant the cotton chinstrap material. But your correct an examination of the male snap would help. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkash23686 Posted October 27, 2016 Share #62 Posted October 27, 2016 Original NOS chinstrap material can still be found. Gary Underhill had quite a bit a few years ago. When I said original I meant the cotton chinstrap material. But your correct an examination of the male snap would help. Rich +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Hazard Posted October 27, 2016 Share #63 Posted October 27, 2016 Taking a second look at the chinstraps I agree with the others, they may be assembled from original material and hardware. Here are photos of NOS chinstraps from WW2 that are still readily available on the market: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Hazard Posted October 27, 2016 Share #64 Posted October 27, 2016 Pic 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Hazard Posted October 27, 2016 Share #65 Posted October 27, 2016 Also, have a look at this comparison with toppots D-Loop; notice how one foot is longer than the other, possible connection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugme Posted October 27, 2016 Share #66 Posted October 27, 2016 Also isnt there some magic number thats accepted for the width of the loops at the base where attached both inside and out side of the feet? This broken D-Loop gives a real good picture of the measurment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plumbob Posted October 27, 2016 Share #67 Posted October 27, 2016 Was there a liner with this pot Frankie? Good shout with the male snaps.Had my m2 for a few years now and never gave it a thought to try and look at the back of the male snaps, I can just about see enough letters to work out what it says. Interesting read this thread. Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted October 27, 2016 Share #68 Posted October 27, 2016 Ronnie; you must not have read my post saying that the "old paratrooper" was KIA in 1945. He was a 1LT and 25 years old when killed in Belgium in 1945 and was in a PIR of the 17th Airborne. I have his name and documentation. And I seriously doubt that his survivors, a widow and daughter, would have had the slightest interest in a repro helmet. No sorry Frankie I didn't see that. So much for that theory. Ronnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catfishcraig Posted October 27, 2016 Share #69 Posted October 27, 2016 So I'm going to throw out the obvious questions about war time manufacturing. Can we really say that a bail is fake based on the length or shape of the feet? I'm sure there were daily quotas and material would not have been trashed if not within 1000th of an inch of the last one made. Ammo maybe but chinstrap bails? Was it always the same hand producing them? If so did the guy or gal never take his/her eye away from their work that might produce a bail different from the last? I'm not in manufacturing so I'm just asking the questions but if we are using this as a tell tell sign of a fake we should also consider that these things can be everyday variations in manufacturing. I understand that opinions are made by multiple inputs and sometimes some of those are intangible. I DO get that and respect those that have the experience to make such an opinion. However if the OP story is true and we are using manufacturing variances to toss aside what looks to to me like it has more of a chance to be good M2 than not are we IMHO doing it justice? My only real question with this helmet is the heat stamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugme Posted October 27, 2016 Share #70 Posted October 27, 2016 My only real question with this helmet is the heat stamp. Bingo! That is the real issue here, everything else that has been discussed has just added to the speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catfishcraig Posted October 27, 2016 Share #71 Posted October 27, 2016 Could it be 66O (letter O) but the font they used did not have an O or it's so close to a zero we can't tell the difference? Just a thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugme Posted October 27, 2016 Share #72 Posted October 27, 2016 Could it be 66O (letter O) but the font they used did not have an O or it's so close to a zero we can't tell the difference? Just a thought Well, it is an interesting thought but, it is also speculative based on: "what if?" Even if it was, 66 it is still far lower than any known production lot numbers for D-Loops just as the 660 is far higher than any know production numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catfishcraig Posted October 27, 2016 Share #73 Posted October 27, 2016 I know I'm stretching it but I'm just looking at the heat stamp from all angles. "O99" upside down??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkash23686 Posted October 28, 2016 Share #74 Posted October 28, 2016 I know I'm stretching it but I'm just looking at the heat stamp from all angles. "O99" upside down??? I've had fixed bales with stamp numbers in the 80s they dont have a 0 in front of them. They show up as 84A etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted October 28, 2016 Author Share #75 Posted October 28, 2016 I'll try to get a pic of the back of the snaps when I return home in about a week. I found this forum while trying to find out about the rounded bales on the helmet, which I had thought was an M1C, and then learned there was such a thing as a heat stamp. Question; would a visible split in the shell cause the Army to scrap the helmet? I'd reveal what I paid for the helmet, but then everyone would hate me. Frank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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