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SOLDIER MEDAL-NAMED- 7/1st CAV 1st AIR CAV


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Ernie

Any chance on seeing the rest of the Grouping? Thanks Jay

 

Yuppers. Only had time for the one pic. Will get on it.

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And my bad. They were NOT part of the 1st AIR CAV Div. But the 12th & 164th Aviation Groups. Vinh Long was in IV CTZ so he was probably with the 164th Avn GP.


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Looks like private engraving. Wonder how he got the Joint Service commendation medal. That would be an interesting citation to read.

 

Also, the citation for his ARCOM is amazing: "..astutely surmounted extremely adverse conditions to obtain consistently superior results.. His unrelenting loyalty, initiative, and perseverance brought him wide acclaim and inspired others to strive for maximum achievement. Selflessly working long and arduous hours, he has contributed significantly to the success of the allied effort." WOW! The author of that citation must have been an English major. Wonder exactly what he did and what the "allied effort" he contributed to so significantly actually was that late in the war. Working with the ARVN?

 

And you are right: He was not a member of the 1st Cavalry Division (Airmobile) but the 1st Cavalry Regiment, an independent unit often confused with the division. Most of the time it was part of the 1st Aviation Brigade.

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FFZ thank you for the information. That is an amazing citation. That was for ARCOM and not the JSCOM? Just wondering if they were confused. Any information on his Soldiers Medal?

 

JAY thank you.No awards certificates.My favorite part was the ZIPPO.According to the Vietnam OOB D/7/1st Cav was a GROUND Recon unit, but from what I found the became AIR CAV when transferred to the 164th AVN GP.

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Ernie, if that lighter could talk the stories it would tell. Congrats!

 

 

LoL!!! I know, I'm still probably not old enough to hear them.I actually got this by accident. I put in the wrong bid amount with 1 second left. :wacko: It was more than I wanted to spend. glad I have it now.

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I really hate to throw cold water on this thread, but I don't like this group. It appears to have been engraved based on the information in the news article. I know this is technically supposed to be privately-done engraving, but between the engraving and the overall aging of the medals doesn't give me a comfortable feeling about the group. Sadly, so much fake Vietnam war engraving has come out that questionable groups have to be looked at as suspect until proven otherwise.

 

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't like it.

 

Just my two cents.

 

Dave

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I really hate to throw cold water on this thread, but I don't like this group. It appears to have been engraved based on the information in the news article. I know this is technically supposed to be privately-done engraving, but between the engraving and the overall aging of the medals doesn't give me a comfortable feeling about the group. Sadly, so much fake Vietnam war engraving has come out that questionable groups have to be looked at as suspect until proven otherwise.

 

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't like it.

 

Just my two cents.

 

Dave

 

I'll have to find when I bought and from where.

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Dave, Do you know how long ago this Florida person was doing this and is it the guy on eBay thats been discussed on the forum before? I don't remember where it came from but i got it approx 18years ago.

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I know he was cranking them out 15yrs ago or so on Ebay

It fits his formula articles and fake engraved medals ! I believe he engraved knives also ? The engraving style with the army rank to me is always a red flag and IMO I don't like any of the group including the lighter it's IMO over the top and ribbons seem artificially aged ! Boven or some eBay name like that I always forget it !

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The citation verbiage was taken from the one newspaper article which identified the award as the ARCOM.

 

Since cold water has already been thrown, I'm going to opine that I, too, think something's wrong with this group. My first suspicion was the JSCOM. This was a fairly new award in 1970 and I'm not sure a SP4 rifleman would have been considered for this meritorious medal. To the best of my knowledge a recipient would have had to have been serving in some capacity with another military branch as a basic requirement for this medal. Anything is possible, of course, but this seems unlikely, especially since in 1970 the concept of "joint" service was in its infancy and it would again seem unlikely that a SP4 would have been in a responsible enough position to justify this award.

 

Although the verbiage for the ARCOM was apparently copied from a press release by whatever paper that was, I have never seen those phrases used in any other citations. They are most unusual, to say the least, and do not conform to the standard phrases typically seen in these low level award citations, even end-of-tour awards. Any ex-clerk can tell you that a "master" citation was used to prepare the recommendation package. I cannot imagine that some unit used this type of phraseology.

 

Just sayin'.

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BOBVN3 was his name

 

Kurt

 

Thanks. I'll have to find the paperwork. I rearranged everything and now I can't remember where i put that stuff.

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Yup, I agree with Dave. the faker is from western PA, and sets up at the Show of Shows (and no doubt other shows) every year. BOBVN3 was his eBay handle, and he sold a ton of self engraved medals on eBay for a few years. Unfortunately, much of his stuff has made its way into the secondary collectors market (i.e., one or more generations removed from the original faker)

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You guys make good points. But if he is such a good faker why a Joint SVC Commendation and not a cheaper, and would match the newspaper, ARCOM? I have no problems with the lighter. By why would he put SGT on there when there was no mention of that rank? And lastly why throw in a SM when there was no mention of one, why not a Silver Star? We have all seen privately engraved medals with rank and place of action from ww2-Vn. Some have even had dates of action.

Not saying you guys are wrong but just pointing out my observations.I wish I could find that paperwork.I know it was around 17-20 years ago that I got this.

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Further to Dave's point, the finish on the SM (and AM as well) sure looks like what you'd find on a very recent strike rather than what you see on VN-era medals. (black lowlights, heavy lacquer, 'brushed' surface)

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It was the font on the lighter that immediately raised red flags for me. Only BOBVN3 used this font and I have never seen it on anything else. From there, I went back and took a closer look at the medals and copied newspaper articles. Everything fits his work.

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RE: the citation phrases included in the one newspaper article.

 

What I am implying is that this verbose phraseology was not typically used for ARCOMs, esp. for junior EM. Here's a sample of a typical citation from the late 1960s: The outstanding manner in which Specialist ***** performed his duties contributed significantly to the effective operation of the Executive Branch. His consientious attitude toward his work has been an example to all who were associated with him."

 

"astutely surmounted extremely adverse conditions"? What the heck does that even mean? If I had to generate an opinion I would say that this flowery language sounds like something a non-veteran would compose. However, I can't get over that it was apparently from a press release reprinted in a newspaper, although I know of cases where PIO staffers created phony hometown press releases for themselves and others and sent them out.

 

If you read a handful of low-level award citations you can easily pick up the patterns.

 

I also still question whether a SP4 infantryman would have merited a JSCM in 1970. Does not seem likely. However, it would be a good piece to doctor up because there was not then, nor is there now, any data base on these level of medals.

 

Good luck.

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