Eric Queen Posted May 24, 2016 Share #1 Posted May 24, 2016 I was happy to pick this one up. William Al Che Say was an Apache Scout under General Crook and played a role in negotiating Geronimo's surrender. There were only 14 Indian Scout MOH winners during the Indian Wars. Thought I would post it as it is not something you see every day http://americangreatness.org/soldiers-stories/sergeant-william-alchesay/#comment-4638 http://www.homeofheroes.com/photos/1_indian/alchesay.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share #2 Posted May 24, 2016 He passed away in 1928 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST Posted May 24, 2016 Share #3 Posted May 24, 2016 That's a great image Eric! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarbridge Posted May 24, 2016 Share #4 Posted May 24, 2016 Thanks for posting...that has to be a tough find... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vintageproductions Posted May 24, 2016 Share #5 Posted May 24, 2016 Killer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan H. Posted May 24, 2016 Share #6 Posted May 24, 2016 That would be killer if he were unidentified. It REALLY takes it up a few notched to have him ID'd AND a MOH recipient. WOW! Allan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
normaninvasion Posted May 24, 2016 Share #7 Posted May 24, 2016 Very nice. Had no idea Indian scouts earned the MOH, looks like most were Apache. Any idea who took the photo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share #8 Posted May 24, 2016 Thanks for looking. Happy to see that some people enjoyed seeing it. I believe it was Fort Apache, AZ Photographer Andrew Miller who took the photo. I have seen others (of other people) with the same background with his stamp on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torch03 Posted May 24, 2016 Share #9 Posted May 24, 2016 Eric, Wow, what a great find! Thanks for sharing it with us! Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakkasan187 Posted May 24, 2016 Share #10 Posted May 24, 2016 Eric, Very nice find. We focus on Indian Scouts at the NCO Museum at Fort Bliss and SGT Alchesay is one of the Indians we talk about. This is a great find.. Leigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 24, 2016 Share #11 Posted May 24, 2016 Another top shelf item! Congrats on another great addition! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share #12 Posted May 24, 2016 Leigh, Dirk Thanks for the comments. Appreciated. Leigh, very interesting. I have often wondered if any of the Scouts medals survived as I am not sure how much importance Native Americas would have placed on these at the time. Does the museum have any of the Scouts medals that the public can see? It would be a treat just to be able to see one. Thanks Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AustinO Posted May 25, 2016 Share #13 Posted May 25, 2016 Great buy! Saw this one listed while I was posting something in the same category. Top notch image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakkasan187 Posted May 25, 2016 Share #14 Posted May 25, 2016 Leigh, Dirk Thanks for the comments. Appreciated. Leigh, very interesting. I have often wondered if any of the Scouts medals survived as I am not sure how much importance Native Americas would have placed on these at the time. Does the museum have any of the Scouts medals that the public can see? It would be a treat just to be able to see one. Thanks Eric Eric, Unfortunately we do not have any of the Indian Medals but to make up for their absence we do focus a lot on the contributions of the Native American Indians who served in the US Armed Forces. We also focus in depth on the raid into Columbus, New Mexico by Pancho Villa and the Punitive Expedition that followed that attack. What is also interesting that most folks do not know was that Indian Scouts led General Pershing and the Cavalry across the border into Mexico. The photo is a great find. Congratulations and I am happy to see it with someone who understands the History.. Leigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KurtA Posted May 25, 2016 Share #15 Posted May 25, 2016 I have often wondered if any of the Scouts medals survived as I am not sure how much importance Native Americas would have placed on these at the time. Eric Years ago, at an antique show I was at in Atlantic City, a dealer had a mint cased 1862 style MOH engraved on the reverse, "Nantaje - Apache Scout". I theorize that this medal was made up for him, but never presented. Hence, it remained in boxed mint condition until it somehow found its way to the collecting market. And I didn't buy the medal, as I was "a bit short" of the asking price of $15K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 25, 2016 Author Share #16 Posted May 25, 2016 Thanks Leigh. Your displays sound great and would love to see them sometime. Something like that always makes you wonder. Interesting that Nanteje (photo below) was also from the White Mountain tribe and received the medal for the same time period as Al Che Say. I have only seen one MOH to a Scout (in this case a Black Seminole) and it too was stone mint in the box. If the medals are real (and I have no reason to doubt the one that I saw) then you almost wonder if the first thing they did after receiving them was take them down to the trading post and trade them for items they would view as more important (material, a new hat, etc.). I just do not know how much importance the Apache would have placed on these medals at the time. Interesting question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 25, 2016 Author Share #17 Posted May 25, 2016 For those interested here is the MOH awarded to Apache Scout Chiquito around the same time of Al Che Say's. It was donated to the Arizona Historical Society by a man who found it with a metal detector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 25, 2016 Author Share #18 Posted May 25, 2016 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
normaninvasion Posted May 25, 2016 Share #19 Posted May 25, 2016 Eric, I would say they would have been very valued. Peace medals were treasured and passed down. However, this begins to change with the reservations. Just like any other valuable item, they were sold off when times got tough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted May 25, 2016 Author Share #20 Posted May 25, 2016 You very well could be right. Pure conjecture on my part. Very cool that at least one unquestionable Apache example survived, even if its only the star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Keith Posted May 25, 2016 Share #21 Posted May 25, 2016 Fantastic thread! Thanks for the great info and photos. BKW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brig Posted June 5, 2016 Share #22 Posted June 5, 2016 Late to the party, and outside my area of expertise, but definitely an impressive photo with great detective work. Eric, you find some of the most impressive portraits I've ever seen. And I know Jeff is enjoying this thread, two of his interests in one photo! Can you imagine, finding a MOH with a metal detector? Glad the detectorist had enough knowledge to be able to identify and recognize the significance of this piece and it didn't get tossed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agate hunter Posted June 8, 2016 Share #23 Posted June 8, 2016 Great historical photo. Thanks for sharing. I'd have to agree with Brig, you find some very nice portraits Eric. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David D Posted June 9, 2016 Share #24 Posted June 9, 2016 Incredible photos, Eric. I've always found Native American involvement in US wars quite interesting. Top shelf pieces for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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