Makeshift radio w/ attached POW Stalag 308 dog tag on FleaBay...

[Martygraw]

Anyone bid on this last week? With an attached descriptive label purportedly glued on by the POW veteran himself, the item literally spoke for itself without any other provenance. Thoughts?

[Martygraw]

Another photo...

[Martygraw]

Photo...

[Bob Hudson]

Wow, what a great piece - thanks for pointing that out.

 

Here's a larger version of the text:

 

 

He said it was "kraut made" and the paper label has the German word for crystal.

 

[firefighter]

If it's legit, the RO's name is Warren Thomas.

 

 

Dates may be UK-style: dd/mm/yy #42-30272 - B-17F Group Squadron Sq Code A/C Code 95BG 335FS Name FRITZ BLITZ MIA 1943-10-10 - MACR #: 1118 Notes 42-30272 Delivered: Cheyenne 7/5/43; Gore 8/5/43; Smoky Hill 17/5/43; Dow Fd 30/5/43; Assigned: 335BS/95BG [OE-U] Horham 15/6/43; MIA (21m) Munster 10/10/43 Pilot: Eldon Broman, Co-Pilot: John Chaffin, Navigator: Bill Fowler, Bombardier: Paul Guiteras, Radio Operator: Warren Thomas, Ball Turret Gunner: Richmond Dillon, Waist Gunner: Frank Dean, Waist Gunner: Jake Black, Tail Gunner: Tom Kelly, obs-Capt Chas Forney (10POW); Engineer / Top Turret Gunner: Roy Rightmire (KIA-anoxia); crashed Haakbergen, Hol; MACR 1118. FRITZ BLITZ. Source B-17 Master Log - Dave Osbourne

[Martygraw]

The story is great.

 

http://untoldvalor.blogspot.com/2008/07/john-chaffin-from-copilot-to-kriegie.html?m=1

 

But is the radio real? Without other provenance, it all depends on whether the POW dog tag is authentic and can be proved to have actually belonged to Warren Thomas, the vet.

 

I will note the radio is awfully clean for something over 70 years old.

[KASTAUFFER]

I personally don't get the warm and fuzzies from this Radio. It's not compact enough as these were meant to be hidden. I also would double check the stalag 308 story. I've never heard of any Americans going through there.

 

Kurt

[Bob Hudson]

I personally don't get the warm and fuzzies from this Radio. It's not compact enough as these were meant to be hidden. I also would double check the stalag 308 story. I've never heard of any Americans going through there.

 

Kurt

 

What a marvelous piece of folk art forgery then.

[KASTAUFFER]

Speaking of folk art, I have actually seen a fake POW diary before that had a Stalag tag attached to it. Someone went through some effort to make it!

 

Kurt

[chris3bs]

This is made very well if it is a fake. Could something that size be hidden in the camp without notice? As I have heard before "If it could only talk". Interesting nonetheless - -

 

Chris

[Bob Hudson]

.

 

 

[KASTAUFFER]

It could also be an actual old radio that someone repurposed into a " POW" radio. It's the Stalag 308 connection that also makes me question this. Its not a camp I have ever seen an American going through and being issued a tag at. Anything is possible.

 

I would not have dropped that kind of cash without attempting to validate that that POW went though that camp and the POW # was actually his,

 

Kurt

[Martygraw]

Exactly.

[Bob Hudson]

.

[Bob Hudson]

It could also be an actual old radio that someone repurposed into a " POW" radio. It's the Stalag 308 connection that also makes me question this. Its not a camp I have ever seen an American going through and being issued a tag at. Anything is possible.

 

They were 10 minutes past Munster on the way home so presumably they would have been heading roughly in the direction of the red arrow on this map: Stalag 308 is quite a long way in the other direction making it unlikely it was someplace he was kept POW for a day or two right after capture.

 

 

The MACR report for this aircraft is long, but there's nothing in it about POW camps except for a reference to one officer going to "POW hospital 13."

[USdog]

Same seller has a fake airborne tag on eBay right now. Should raise a red flag.

[Bob Hudson]

Same seller has a fake airborne tag on eBay right now. Should raise a red flag.

 

Turns out this ebay seller has been the topic of discussion for several years now:

 

https://www.google.com/#safe=off&hl=en&q=site:usmilitariaforum.com+%22estateman79%22

[KurtA]

Seems like this item was inspired by 3 TV shows- Hogan's Heroes, Antique Roadshow, and Fantasy Island.

[Bob Hudson]

Turns out there were three Stalag 308's - one in the Ukraine, one near Poland and one a short drive from Munster, well within direction and range for a B-17 ten minutes after bombing Munster.

 

[dave peifer]

i'm not a radio person but looking at the radio i am wondering how it would have worked.doesn't seem to have many components internaly................dave

[Bob Hudson]

i'm not a radio person but looking at the radio i am wondering how it would have worked.doesn't seem to have many components internaly................dave

 

It only needs a tuning coil and crystal detector. The crystal in this one is inside a glass cover. There's a cat whisker making contact with the crystal and a way to adjust that connection so it generates a small electrical signal. The tuning coil has a heavy piece of wire that can be moved along it to tune in different frequencies (in the photo you can see the arc scratched on the coil by the movement of the tuning wire).

 

A long wire is connected as an antenna and it also needs a ground wire connection. A pair of headphones completes the setup.

 

 

Here's one of the US Navy's very first shipboard radio receivers: it is a crystal detector. The tuning coil was a separate piece, but it still needed just that, headphones, an antenna and a ground.

 

This one held three crystals, but some of the pieces for the holders are missing:

 

 

 

Later as audio amplifiers with vacuum tubes became available you could attach that to the headphone connections and listen through a speaker.

[dave peifer]

ok great,thanks bob..........so it would have been a workable set up.............i learned something...............dave

[Martygraw]

Thanks for the information on radios. Good stuff. The problem with this piece, though, is proving authenticity, not functionality.

[dave peifer]

Thanks for the information on radios. Good stuff. The problem with this piece, though, is proving authenticity, not functionality.

i agree,my first thought,too good to be true

[Bob Hudson]

i agree,my first thought,too good to be true

 

If it's fake, I have to hand it to the creator for doing a very good job. Presumably it had to be made by somone who knew this POW as it jibes with the actual documented experience. The Stalag 308 issue seems to be a big concern, but it turns out that was a Stalag 308 very near to where he went down.

 

As someone who spent much of his youth as a ham radio operator using and making all manner of gear, I have no qualms about the radio itself being old: in fact it looks a bit dirtier than many of the cigar box radios I found online. The front of the box has a "Hauptstadt" label a German word that shows up in some google searches related to Cuban cigars.