12/1941 SA M1 Garand

[ClaptonIsGod]

I picked up this Garand a while ago, and wanted to share it and gain some new knowledge. It's in the 41XXXX range, which puts it probably in the middle of December 1941. The person I bought it from said he bought it from the person that bought it from the DCM (which supposedly did a rebuild) in the 1960s, so I'm the third civilian owner. I've only done some basic disassembly, so my collection of part numbers is probably limited. My questions: How much of it is original to the factory/at least WWII service? Is there any way to guess whether my Garand went overseas? Also, any chance the sling might be WWII?

 

Thanks.

 

Numbers I've gathered:

Barrel: SA 6535448 9 64 Y58 PM (so September 1964?)

Bolt: D28287-12SA B4A

Safety: MXR

Trigger assembly: D28290-14-SA

Inside stock: 2086

Op rod: D35382 SA

 

With a reproduction bayonet:

 

 

The stamp is pretty faded, but maybe someone can decipher it to see if the stock's WWII:

 

 

Stamp inside the stock:

 

 

[Chris_B]

I am not near my reference right now, but the cartouche on the stock is the 'Chicken and stars', and that is a post-WWII stamp.

 

However that only means the stamp was used post-war. It doesn't mean the stock was made after 1945.

 

Nice rifle.

[ccyooper]

It appears the receiver is the only original part to the rifle. It was rebuilt at Red River as indicated on the receiver leg. The bolt, trigger guard, trigger housing, and maybe the gas cylinder are the only parts that appear to be WWII based upon what you have listed. It is hard to tell on my phone but it looks like your sling may be a repro. It looks like a nice rrad rebuild and should be a good shooter. Thanks for sharing.

[Orlando]

Nothing on the rifle dates to 1941 except the receiver and maybe the trigger guard. It has more than likely gone through several rebuilds the last one in 1965. The DOD "chicken and stars" stamp was only used on Post War stocks and it appears to be a IHC stock but would need to see another picture of the stock taken looking down at the area where the back of the receiver sets

[ClaptonIsGod]

Thanks for the replies and info. Since its parts are from all over as far as years go, is it probably fair to assume that this rifle saw use in the field? Presumably if it was never used and sat in an armory, it would've only needed minimal overhaul before surplussing through the DCM. I realize it's anyone's guess, but if a lot of the internals are mid-war, then it probably was being used during the war and needed wartime repairs (assuming they didn't just use NOS WWII parts at RRAD). I guess I get the best of both worlds in that it is from the front end of Garand production and has character, but it's also not perfect or a safe queen so I can have fun with it. Below is a photo of the stock. Thanks again all for the info.

 

[Orlando]

stock appears to be IHC

[Chris_B]

Orlando, I didn't know that about the post-war cartouche!

 

Clapton, it is sure it was used for something, but I personally wouldn't assume that if it never went overseas it would lead an easy life in the training barracks, and that overhaul or or even heavy use means it saw combat or even a trip overseas.

 

To my way of thinking, if the rifle was in the States from '41 to '45, it would be much easier for Uncle Sam to have his eye- and his mitts- on it.

 

Then too, training life would see it handled by many neophyte hands which is not conducive to good condition. Training could be very dirty and very abusive to the equipment. In the book 'GI Victory' there's a great photo of a recruit in 1944 Stateside, carrying the most god-awfully worn M1.

 

I am convinced that my own 1944 Springfield M1 never left the US at any time in its life, despite its 1946 barrel and (what seems to be) more than one overhaul. I think it was used in training until the end of the war and repaired as needed with whatever parts were most convenient and then stored. After the war it was overhauled when peacetime priorities 'caught up' with it and it was stored, but never issued for Korea. At least that is my gut feeling for my own rifle.

 

With yours, I would think that whatever it did during the war, it returned to an arsenal and was repaired and up-revved with new drawing parts, and then was put back into service, possibly even going to Korea but I should think it was at least used for training at the time. Then it was overhauled at least once more and stored for the big one with the Russkies. I bet its a good shooter, and no matter what it has an honorable history: even if it was never fired in anger, it trained those who won the war which is possibly even more critical.

[1563621]

Rebuilds have become sought after, nice one!

[Orlando]

Rebuilds have become sought after, nice one!

 

1960's rebuilds have become sought after.

I started collecting these years ago when no one else wanted them. Now they bring a premium over earlier rebuilds

[hink441]

Very nice Garand. It is almost impossible to determine the history of the rifle, and usually any attempt is nothing but speculation. Could have been used anywhere.

 

The International Harvester Stock is really nice and has a lot of appeal to collectors.

 

Very nice!!

 

Chris

[ClaptonIsGod]

Never would've thought a 1960s rebuild would be remotely desirable, so I guess that makes me feel a little better about my purchase. For my own sanity, I just broke it down again to check inside the stock because of the white splotch seen in the photo of the stamp inside the stock. To my relief, it was just the lighting of the photo. I guess having an IHC stock makes up for the time I almost bought a Scout but didn't. Did IHC make stocks after the war, or was this NOS before it got the DOD stamp and put on?

[Orlando]

That stock was not DOD stamped for your rebuild,it was done originally for a IHC rifle. In fact that stock may not have even been installed during the RRAD rebuild. Someone may have installed it later, there is no way of knowing. As I remember RRAD rebuilds had RRAD stamped on the stock. I cant remember if there was a time that they werent. I would have to check my notes

[Dogface72]

Orlando-

 

Do you have any idea as to who or how many arsenals marked their rebuilds on the receiver leg? This is new and interesting to me (only 10 years experience so excuse my ignorance) . I'm assuming this is a month / year marking. Just have not seen any. Any insight or literature on those particular markings I would like to learn more? - Chris

[doyler]

Its a great rifle.Pretty much tells a story of its life.So many of these have now been messed with.People buy them and have to make them "correct" by replacing parts, barrels etc and to me by doing this its just a restored rifle or inhanced.Rifles from the DCM/CMP are how these weapons ended their service.To me more original than a restored artifake. I own a Winchester and a Springfield.I shot and qualified under our old DCM program for the Springfield.Cost $265 to order it and came from Anniston. THE Winchester is from the same program and I bought it from a co-worker for $350 about 5 years after he got it.Both are a mix but I wouldn't change a thing.

 

I own a 43 dated Springfield as well.Barrel and reciever are a month or so apart which is acceptable.Bought it at an auction about 10 years ago.Buddy wanted to gauge it.He did and said it was 3+ on the throat and about 4 at the muzzle.I said cool....he thought I was nuts.I said indicates more than likely its all original and a honest WW2 rifle.Stock was sanded and oiled but you can barely see the SA BOX WITH inspector.Never went through it til last April.Had the Garand Man look at it at a show.First thing he asked was "Want to Sell it?...I declined and he proceeded to tell me that it was all as it should be right down to an uncut open rod.He asked where I got it.I told him a local estate gun auction.I even saw the owners records where he got the rifle in 1968 for $65 but no further info other than he recorded the serial number.I havent shot it but the Garand Man said shoot it and have fun.Just check your casings for any unusual wear every 50-100 rounds.He made a good offer and said if the barrel was a bit tighter he would pay more.He said he would change if it were his for resale purposes but I wont.Like her just the way she is.

 

Enjoy your rifle.Its a beauty.

[aef1917]

Rifles from the DCM/CMP are how these weapons ended their service.

 

 

My dad and a friend of his volunteered for a week at Anniston. They don't just take them out of crates and put them out for sale. There's quite a bit of parts swapping that goes on there.

[doyler]

 

My dad and a friend of his volunteered for a week at Anniston. They don't just take them out of crates and put them out for sale. There's quite a bit of parts swapping that goes on there.

 

Agreed...my point is thats how its done from government end point.I know guy thought bought rifles or had them rebuilt at Camp Perry matches.One guy here use to buy rifles years ago then take 5-10 out there and have them gone through and get them made over.

 

Not some clown switching out stuff in the bathroom at a gunshow then telling people its "original"...lol

[Orlando]

Rifle was rebuilt Feb 1965 at Red River Army Depot. The practice of etching reciver legs was only done on rebuilds in the 60's, not on earlier rebuilds