Camillus military folding pocket knives - can someone educate me?

[dag]

Pictured is a Camillus knife my dad obtained, not sure where. It was not his in the military as he was in the Coast Guard and many years before 1972. But I did have an uncle in the Army about that time. Now I'm wondering if it was his??

 

I see lots of these on the internet, listed as a "military" knife. I only realized recently about the dates, and paid attention for the first time about this one dated 1972.

 

Who used these (in the military)? And when did they make these (I've seen some from the late 1950's thru early 2000's in the internet). I assume the stamped year is truly the year it was made??

 

Thanks in advance

[bayonetman]

Military terminology is Knife, Pocket, General Purpose, MilSpec MIL-K-818 usually followed by a letter indicating minor changes in the design.

 

They are made of Corrosion Resistant Steel (often called Stainless Steel)

 

Camillus made these knives from 1957 through 2006. Other companies made them at various times.

 

The knife was, and I believe still is, a General Issue knife to all military services and is in a number of different kits as well as being issued by itself. It was also sold commercially to whoever wanted one, to service personnel through the PX system as well as to the general public.

 

[dag]

Thanks bayonetman. Just what I was looking for.

[Misfit 45]

The knife style goes back to WWII in late 1944. Imperial and Ulster combined efforts and made them under the name Kingston. The first one was a US Marine Corps. contract, and soon after, an Army version which is mostly unmarked except with the name Kingston on the clevis. The Stevenson company was also a maker during WWII. In 1948, a version came out which has the mark "Ulster-48". As far as I know, from 1948 to 1957 there were no makers of this Knife except the very rare "Camillus 1949".

Marv

[dag]

Thanks for the additional history.

[thorin6]

The knife style goes back to WWII in late 1944. Imperial and Ulster combined efforts and made them under the name Kingston. The first one was a US Marine Corps. contract, and soon after, an Army version which is mostly unmarked except with the name Kingston on the clevis. The Stevenson company was also a maker during WWII. In 1948, a version came out which has the mark "Ulster-48". As far as I know, from 1948 to 1957 there were no makers of this Knife except the very rare "Camillus 1949".

Marv

 

Here are five early (WWII) non-Camillus steel knives.

 

[thorin6]

The knife style goes back to WWII in late 1944. Imperial and Ulster combined efforts and made them under the name Kingston. The first one was a US Marine Corps. contract, and soon after, an Army version which is mostly unmarked except with the name Kingston on the clevis. The Stevenson company was also a maker during WWII. In 1948, a version came out which has the mark "Ulster-48". As far as I know, from 1948 to 1957 there were no makers of this Knife except the very rare "Camillus 1949".

Marv

 

And here is the 1949 dated Camillus:

 

[bayonetman]

Kingston also made the Boy Scout version in the late 1940s and a blade etched US one.

 

 

[sactroop]

Wow! I love that U.S. blade etched Kingston. The whole post WW2 to about 57 is a real head scratcher for me with these knives.

[2MOB]

Seems like Bayonetman was quite an expert.  I really admire how you guys keep his posts up and do the In Memoriam thing.  Very cool, very classy.  I wonder if he actually owned the BSA Kingston he showed that pic of?  Do any of you other gents know about that particular variant?   He said "late 40s' on the date.. I would like to know if that could be more specific.  Also I wanted to know if there were any other markings?  (Tang, etc. other than the BSA logo on the blade) Here are some BSA knives of the MIL-K 818 variety.

The first was sent to me by a friend.  If anyone knows the owner of the pic, please advise so I can credit.

It shows a Kingston (bail marked) with eagles beak can opener (no CAN OPENER or PAT PEND markings) Also the first configuration is shown.  No US markings on the scales.  The faint BSA Logo and OFFICIAL KNIFE  wording can be read on the blade. 

The second two pics show another BSA knife.  This one is a 2nd arrangement style, marked Kingston (bail) No US marks, (no markings on the tang).  Also the Can Opener, the eagle beak type, is not marked with patents or the Can Opener phrase. 

I know the logo here is hard to see.  The BSA fleur-de-lis is actually lined up with the length of the blade, if that helps.

Are these knives of interest to collectors?  Are they rare?  Any reference book you could recommend?   I have several now, but this isnt in the subject list.

Anyway, thank you (as always) to those of you who have spent so many long hours educating yourselves, and graciously passing the knowledge down to people like me.  Regards- John 

[sactroop]

Lots of knives that were still at their factories and not in the delivery pipeline at the time that the Government contracts were suddenly all cancelled were creatively marketed.  I've tried over the years to get a better sense of how much reciprocal support the Government was able to provide the Boy Scouts of American compared to the amount of support they supplied to the Government. IE, scrap drives and the rationing book distribution to name but two examples.  Really haven't found much for the time frame of the war.  I feel that it should be noted that during the war knives were not available as a general rule to the general public.  The priority was first and foremost the war effort with solders and sailors number one with the defense support industries next in line to be sure the tools necessary to complete the job were in the right place.  

It's very possible that by the end of the war there was a good market available to restock as it were young scouts who had to do with less during the war.  In studying documents for Boy Scout knives it shows that knives that are recognizable as consistent with war time production were etched with different Boy Scout identifiers, usually on the main blade.  Companies I've personally seen include Camillus, and Imperial KAC, as well as PAL and others.  Some document make a general reference to this having pretty much run its course by 1948.

I also see WW2 type knives with etching like Craftman, and some private companies.  Since blade etching are known to be fragile I suppose the examples out there are likely to only represent the tip of the iceberg.

Probably the most often quoted book on Scout knives is "600 Scout Knives".  there is a lot of good information contained in it.  However the book is full of less than excellently researched information too.  So much so that independent verification is a good idea.  Since the book is as popular as it is in its own circle, it's often quoted without identifying it as the source.  So it can be tricky to be sure of the details.

[thorin6]

Check out the sticky notes at the top of this forum.

 

[MattS]

Older thread, but wanted to mention these were standard issue to Army helicopter aircrew and carried in the SRU-21P survival vest. 

 

And Gary's expertise is missed by many.