Charlie Flick Posted January 27, 2016 Share #1 Posted January 27, 2016 The New York Times is reporting on the recent government order requiring local law enforcement agencies across the country to return a wide variety of vehicles, APCs, weapons and other items which had been provided earlier at no cost. Some local agencies are complaining about having to return this equipment which they regard as essential to performing their local missions. The article includes a pic, seen below, of one of the 16 plated bayonets which had been provided to the Oakland County Sheriff's Office. The article goes on to say: The sheriff said the department had also had to return some of its bayonets, which he said deputies used sometimes to cut through seatbelts after car crashes. Deputies also place decorative chrome bayonets over the barrels of their assault rifles during parades and other community events. Each of the 16 recalled bayonets was used for such ceremonial functions, he said. “There’s no police department in America that fixes bayonets to rifles and charges into a crowd,” Sheriff Bouchard said. “I mean, if you can trust our folks with a semiautomatic handgun, you can’t give them a big knife?” The complete article can be found here: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/27/us/some-sheriffs-bristle-at-recall-of-military-equipment.html?&moduleDetail=section-news-0&action=click&contentCollection=U.S.®ion=Footer&module=MoreInSection&version=WhatsNext&contentID=WhatsNext&pgtype=article Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharfmaster Posted January 27, 2016 Share #2 Posted January 27, 2016 Good. With the exception of SWAT Teams, Cops should not have Auto. or Semi-auto weapons. Pump shotguns and 6 shot revolvers only. Concerning camo, it should be worn by the US Military in combat zones only. No camo in CONUS to be worn by the military OR police. We still have a National Guard. They need and should have the military gear only. Wharf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #3 Posted January 27, 2016 They found out we want to buy them and want to make a buck. I doubt the police really need or use them. I thought they all carried assisted opening,belt cutting knives anyway. I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutiger83 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #4 Posted January 27, 2016 The one thing that jumps out at me is that the NY Times is the ONLY news media reporting this. I can find NOTHING ELSE on the internet to support this article. How do we know the truth when only ONE news media is reporting this story? The one thing that I did find was that in 2014, Obama ordered a review of the program because of waste, abuse, and fraud. However, AFTER the review was completed, Obama ultimately decided to keep the program. Until other news media report this story, treat this article with a grain of salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collector Posted January 27, 2016 Share #5 Posted January 27, 2016 Hope I don't get in a crash there if the best knife they have for cutting seatbelts is an M1 bayonet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor996 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #6 Posted January 27, 2016 Hope I don't get in a crash there if the best knife they have for cutting seatbelts is an M1 bayonet funny, I was thinking the same thing.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skautdog Posted January 27, 2016 Share #7 Posted January 27, 2016 Such recalls are NOT an example of bureaucracy run a muck. This recall action is a recent decision made by the President of the United States of America. Check with the San Bernardino, CA Police Chief and see if local police departments have a need for military armament and equipment. A quick Google search will identify the recall action identified by various police departments and news reporting agencies. The President's decision is reported as his concern of the "militarization" of police departments. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vintageproductions Posted January 27, 2016 Share #8 Posted January 27, 2016 Keep the comments about the article only. Anymore political attacks and we will just delete the whole thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #9 Posted January 27, 2016 Wasn't there a Thompson machine gun returned to a Sheriffs office not long ago someplace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY Militaria Posted January 27, 2016 Share #10 Posted January 27, 2016 Good. With the exception of SWAT Teams, Cops should not have Auto. or Semi-auto weapons. Pump shotguns and 6 shot revolvers only. Concerning camo, it should be worn by the US Military in combat zones only. No camo in CONUS to be worn by the military OR police. We still have a National Guard. They need and should have the military gear only. Wharf As a Law Enforcement Officer, I would love to hear your rationale on your first statement. Do enlighten me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #11 Posted January 27, 2016 I didn't understand that either. What I DO feel is that any weapon the police are allowed I should be allowed also. Right now,that is the law in Wi. I can carry a handgun,knife,or electric weapon and own a automatic weapon if I wish. (The Attorney General said I could) I just want to see it stay that way and not go backwards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMC-RECON0321 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #12 Posted January 27, 2016 Good. With the exception of SWAT Teams, Cops should not have Auto. or Semi-auto weapons. Pump shotguns and 6 shot revolvers only. Concerning camo, it should be worn by the US Military in combat zones only. No camo in CONUS to be worn by the military OR police. We still have a National Guard. They need and should have the military gear only. Wharf As a Law Enforcement Officer, I would love to hear your rationale on your first statement. Do enlighten me... I 2nd that! Dumbest thing I ever seen posted. Sorry mods I can't ignore such a statement from someone who obviously has no idea what we face out there in Law Enforcement! Maybe we should ride horses and wear spurs also. Better yet, I declare the US a gun free zone! There... No more need for police to carry guns at all! LOL WOW!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strawberry 9 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #13 Posted January 27, 2016 Good. With the exception of SWAT Teams, Cops should not have Auto. or Semi-auto weapons. Pump shotguns and 6 shot revolvers only. Concerning camo, it should be worn by the US Military in combat zones only. No camo in CONUS to be worn by the military OR police. We still have a National Guard. They need and should have the military gear only. Wharf When the bullets are flying, SWAT is only 10 minutes away...at the very least. Some of us are blessed to live in quiet areas of the country with little chance of a terrorist attack or problems with violent crime. If you expect the Police to deal with modern day problems then give them the tools they need. Otherwise, protect yourself. That being said, I can't imagine carrying around a bayonet as a Police Officer. Ceremonial...sure, functional...no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #14 Posted January 27, 2016 I 2nd that! Dumbest thing I ever seen posted. Sorry mods I can't ignore such a statement from someone who obviously has no idea what we face out there in Law Enforcement! Maybe we should ride horses and wear spurs also. Better yet, I declare the US a gun free zone! There... No more need for police to carry guns at all! LOL WOW!! Now that made me laugh! Nice to see cops with a sense of humor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutiger83 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #15 Posted January 27, 2016 As a Law Enforcement Officer, I would love to hear your rationale on your first statement. Do enlighten me... I didn't understand that either. Dumbest thing I ever seen posted. As someone on the outside looking in, I interpreted the first sentence as someone just trying to be funny and passed the statement right on by. With that being said, I don't think anyone would disagree that the police need to be able to protect themselves. I have all of the respect in the world for law enforcement. However, how much protection do they really need? The article was about the misuse, abuse and unnecessary equipment being given to law enforcement not about the police protecting themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #16 Posted January 27, 2016 Yes they do need to protect themselves and ME! When I call the cops I want them to be there 5 minutes ago and bring it! Until they arrive,make me be able to defend myself. I don't want to bring a knife to a gun fight or face a automatic weapon with my Mossberg 500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY Militaria Posted January 27, 2016 Share #17 Posted January 27, 2016 As someone on the outside looking in, I interpreted the first sentence as someone just trying to be funny and passed the statement right on by. With that being said, I don't think anyone would disagree that the police need to be able to protect themselves. I have all of the respect in the world for law enforcement. However, how much protection do they really need? The article was about the misuse, abuse and unnecessary equipment being given to law enforcement not about the police protecting themselves. Kat, the short answer is that we need to be better armed and equipped than the best criminals out there. We hope to never use such tools, but having them is necessary for the protection of society. Anything less results in potential death or injury to the innocent. There is always a single officer who is the first on scene and first to go in to any active killer situation. He or she deserves the best equipment (i.e. military grade) available to diffuse the incident. Some Law Enforcement Officers' backup is more than 20 minutes away on a daily basis. Keep in mind that most military units, armed to the teeth, don't go into such situations without less than a squad or at least a team's worth of personnel, with a cordon in place. With regard to the article itself, the bayonet use for cutting seat belts seems odd, but unheard of? You never know! Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #18 Posted January 27, 2016 Kat, the short answer is that we need to be better armed and equipped than the best criminals out there. We hope to never use such tools, but having them is necessary for the protection of society. Anything less results in potential death or injury to the innocent. There is always a single officer who is the first on scene and first to go in to any active killer situation. He or she deserves the best equipment (i.e. military grade) available to diffuse the incident. Some Law Enforcement Officers' backup is more than 20 minutes away on a daily basis. Keep in mind that most military units, armed to the teeth, don't go into such situations without less than a squad or at least a team's worth of personnel, with a cordon in place. My "Backup" is a few minutes away too. Right? With regard to the article itself, the bayonet use for cutting seat belts seems odd, but unheard of? You never know! Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garandomatic Posted January 27, 2016 Share #19 Posted January 27, 2016 Lack of firepower sure was a problem in North Hollywood a few years ago. Backup in my county could be anywhere from 5-45 minutes away. I get the fear of over militarization, but a rifle beats a pistol, and I'd rather the good guys have a rifle in the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw517 Posted January 27, 2016 Share #20 Posted January 27, 2016 The bottom line is a citizen should have the tools to protect him or her self against the same threats as the police. If it takes my backup, (the Sheriffs Dept) even one minute to get here it's too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brig Posted January 28, 2016 Share #21 Posted January 28, 2016 The department likely had to return the bayonets because they were SL3 to the rifles...I bet they also returned 16 assault rifles. Same as I have to turn in my cleaning gear and BFA when I deissue a rifle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sactroop Posted January 28, 2016 Share #22 Posted January 28, 2016 If I'm not mistaken those bayonets only fit on Springfield's and M1 Garand's. Pretty good if we're waiting for Poncho Villa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutiger83 Posted January 28, 2016 Share #23 Posted January 28, 2016 Kat, the short answer is that we need to be better armed and equipped than the best criminals out there. We hope to never use such tools, but having them is necessary for the protection of society. Anything less results in potential death or injury to the innocent. Justin Justin, I agree but from what I can find, they are prohibiting equipment made for the battlefield that is not appropriate for local police departments. It states "Banned will be tracked armored vehicles, bayonets, grenade launchers, camouflage uniforms, and large-caliber weapons and ammunition." There is some equipment that will still be available to the local police but only with proper training.That equipment includes aircraft, wheeled tactical vehicles, mobile command-and-control units, battering rams and riot gear. As it states, this is only for local police. It says nothing about specialized police units such as SWAT teams, ...Kat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brig Posted January 28, 2016 Share #24 Posted January 28, 2016 Justin, I agree but from what I can find, they are prohibiting equipment made for the battlefield that is not appropriate for local police departments. It states "Banned will be tracked armored vehicles, bayonets, grenade launchers, camouflage uniforms, and large-caliber weapons and ammunition." There is some equipment that will still be available to the local police but only with proper training.That equipment includes aircraft, wheeled tactical vehicles, mobile command-and-control units, battering rams and riot gear. As it states, this is only for local police. It says nothing about specialized police units such as SWAT teams, ...Kat Grenade launchers are good for riot control...there exist many non-lethal rounds designed specifically for this type of activity. Foam baton, CS Gas, rubber ball, etc. Normally, I don't think riot control falls on SWAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutiger83 Posted January 28, 2016 Share #25 Posted January 28, 2016 Grenade launchers are good for riot control...there exist many non-lethal rounds designed specifically for this type of activity. Foam baton, CS Gas, rubber ball, etc. Normally, I don't think riot control falls on SWAT And that would fall under the less lethal grenade launcher for riot control. They state they will still be giving them riot gear. ...Kat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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