WW1 89th Patch on Ebay

[scmcgeorge]

All: Sunflower represents 353d Infantry - The Kansas Regiment. Steve McG

[aef1917]

The center patch in Post #22 is a faded 341st MG Bn. 314th Engineers looks like the one to its right, but with a red center. The one with the purple center seems to have been used by a number of the Division's Trains.

 

64th FA with a C in the center is 341st FA Rgt.

 

177th Infanfantry Bde. with a sunflower was for the Kansas NG units in the Brigade.

 

Plain purple centers are most likely faded blue.

[svt40]

So it seems I have a lot more uniforms to gather...and I thought the artillery uniform was the hardest to find so far.

 

I also think the white centers with no cross are the sanitary train while those with the cross are the medical side of the 314th. This is just my personal thoughts.

[world war I nerd]

Thanks everybody for filling in the information gaps.

 

I've saved photos of a couple of 89th Division patches that look yellow not orange. Does anyone know anything about yellow, which certainly could have been substituted if orange fabric wasn't available.

[mortaydc60]

This should be placed in Shoulder Patch section for most use. Mort

[MT247]

Maybe the mods will pin it

[world war I nerd]

I was going through some 89th Division photos and noticed that this guy, who's wearing a Quartermaster collar disc has what looks to be the numeral '2' on the white (314th Supply Train) section of his 89th Division SSI.

 

Photos courtesy of Brennan Gauthier portraitsof war.wordpress.com

 

Any ideas?

[aef1917]

I've never seen anything to indicate that the 314th Supply Train wore a white center. I think what you're seeing is the purple center to the typical Trains purple/white outline insignia.

[svt40]

Updated

 

 

The center color can be:

 

Light Blue = 177th Inf.

-------Light Blue with Sunflower = 353rd Inf. Rgt

Dark Blue = 178th Inf.

 

Orange = Signal

Purple/White outline = Supply

Red/White outline = Engineers

White or White with Red Cross = Sanitary train or Medical.

 

Red/Orange = 340th MG (un-verified)

Lt Blue/Red = 341st MG

DK Blue/Red = 342nd MG

Orange/Red = 343rd MG

 

Red = 164th FA

------Red with C = 341st FA Rgt

 

Blank = HQ Div

 

 

If you label the four outer parts from L-R starting at the bottom and going counter clockwise:

 

Lower Left = Best Company or Battery in Battalion

Upper Left = Best Battalion in Regiment

Upper Right = Best Regiment in Brigade

Lower Right = Best Brigade in Division.

[aef1917]

There was no 343rd MG Bn. in the 89th Division. There was an error in some reference work or other years ago, which has propagated to every subsequent reference work. Orange/Red is 340th MG Bn.

[RustyCanteen]

Excellent contribution WWINerd!

 

 

Just to add, that I have always heard that these strips of two were cut from the rolls (as your post indicates) with one being for the overcoat, and one for the service coat.

 

RC

 

I am going to pin this and move it to the 'Army' SSI section, but I will leave a link in this section to redirect people to the thread's new location.

[svt40]

Lemme try again

 

The center color can be:

 

Light Blue = 177th Inf.

-------Light Blue with Sunflower = 353rd Inf. Rgt

Dark Blue = 178th Inf.

 

Orange = Signal

Purple/White outline = Supply

Red/White outline = Engineers

White or White with Red Cross = Sanitary train or Medical.

 

Red/Orange = 340th MG

Light Blue/Red = 341st MG

Dark Blue/Red = 342nd MG

 

Red = 164th FA

------Red with C = 341st FA Rgt

 

Blank = HQ Div

 

 

 

Looking through the rosters and histories I came across some things confirming what we have and even more anomalies.

 

Looking at several unit histories and rosters for the 89th and from those it looks like the C on the 341st arty is for Company C. At least company C is the only one to display the C on the the SSI on their roster. But also looking at the 341st it does appear that they mostly came from Colorado. So who knows. However the other companies I have access to only show the red center with no letter.

 

Looking at the company history for the 353rd and it does indeed show the flower.

 

Ambulance Company 355 of the 314th Sanitary train shows what looks to be a white center with a light blue border and the red cross.

[MT247]

Here is an example of my 178th Inf painted helmet, hard to see on the picture but the center is a dark blue. I'm guessing that his patch would have looked very similar.

 

[world war I nerd]

AEF1917,

 

It sure looks like a '2', but I think you're right about the insignia in post no. 32 having a purple center with a wider than normal white border. It's always amazing what a different pair of eyes see ...

 

Also don't forget that we still don't know if the 314th MP Company had a color of its own or not.

[unclegrumpy]

Here is possibly a tighter identification for the 89th Division patch with purple center with white border...I say "possibly", because I don't know that color combination was not used by other units.

 

The patch below is identified to a soldier from Nebraska that served in Co. E, of the 314th Motor Supply Train. It is one of the nicest WW I 89ths I have seen, and clearly made in France or the occupation using high quality purple medal ribbon for the center, and silver bullion military uniform lace/tress for the white border.

 

From page 126 of the unit history pictured below:

 

"The shell in the Supply Train insignia was of purple, representing the Motor Transportation Corps. Later to distinguish this from the colors of the 177th Infantry Brigade, a thin line of white piping was put around the purple shell".

[unclegrumpy]

I was just asked the vintage of the 314th Motor Supply Train unit history. It was published "29 April, 1919", but it does not say where or by who. They appear to have been still overseas, and the book looks likely to have been printed in Germany.

[world war I nerd]

Uncle 'G' ... I just saw this post for the first time. Thanks for the info & images of the white trimmed, purple inset for the 89th Division's 314th Motor Supply Train insignia!

 

Still wondering whether or not if there was a separate 89th Division insignia representing the 314th MP Company with color or colors of its own???

[unclegrumpy]

Nerd, your question regarding the the possibility of separate 314th MP Company insignia leads to a thought.

 

We have a Forum category for items that are wanted, but I don't believe one for asking for information like this. It would be nice to see these questions pulled out of threads and put someplace more prominent. However, the structure of this new category/section would need some thought, otherwise it would just be cluttered by questions that there are known answers to.

 

Maybe the easy solution would be to make inclusion into this new information wanted category to be at the will and discretion of the Moderators. Using the 314th MP Company insignia as an example, that would be a pretty high bar, because there are several Mods that are walking patch & insignia encyclopedias...with every known patch and ASMIC Journal article about them fully committed to memory.

 

In recognition of your most excellent threads on the First World War, I'd suggest they promote you to Moderate the WW I sections. I bet there are some answers to these mysteries out there...like maybe in this case, a neat little 314th MP Company unit history or their 1918 Christmas Menu or ??? with a patch on it.

 

 

[lamarhooten]

Here is an example i have that is on a 'bring back' patch pillow

[zippo88]

The "C" in the center that sometimes is seen with the artillery patches is actually for "Colorado" specifically the 341st FA where a majority of its personnel came from. Not that all dissimilar to the sunflower used by the Kansas men.