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Navy Corpsman uniform question


medalcollector
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medalcollector

Hello all,

 

I looked everywhere I can but couldn't find a clarification. So I thought I'll as the question.

 

There are two specialty marks shown below. The Red Cross, as far as I know is for a pharmacists mate and the 2nd is for a hospital corpsman. From what I found, Pharmacists mates act as the field medics (during battle) and the hospital corpsman are typically at base hospitals. Is that correct? I'm basically asking which rating is worn by a field medic (excuse me... A corpsman) Can someone please point me in the right direction?

 

Thanks.

post-151439-0-98862600-1424652731.jpg

post-151439-0-69425000-1424652739.jpg

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The rating on the left was worn up until shortly after the end of WW2....I believe they switched from the red cross to the caduceus in 1948 during the overhaul. In essence, it is the same rating from two different time periods....the old rate style and the new one. The name also switched from Pharmacist Mate to Hospital Corpsman.

 

Philip

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Not 100 % sure but the red cross was a registered trademark when the mark was changed but these guys were always under the auspices of the Hospital Corp which I believe made them a Corpsman even though they were Pharmacist Mate.

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The term "Corpsman" comes from them being members of the "US Navy Hospital Corps". The Red Cross was worn until 1948 then switched to the cadusis. As was stated, szme rate, same job, different time feames

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Just for further clarification, the rate on the left would have been made at some point between 1941 and 1948, while the one on the right is from the mid 1980s at the earliest.

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The chart above explains it well.

 

In WWII the seaman class Hospital Apprentice 3rd through 1st class uses the small red cross rating specialty patch with the piping on their jumper to denote the class.

 

Then the Pharmacist Mates 3rd through 1st Class uses the red Cross rank.

 

They are Pharmacist Mate regardless if they are a Corpsman or not.

 

LF

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That is a very cool chart, though is missing a column, if you are a patch collector. There should be a column to the right of the 1916 column, dated 1941 with the same text, except with the eagles facing left.

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That is a very cool chart, though is missing a column, if you are a patch collector. There should be a column to the right of the 1916 column, dated 1941 with the same text, except with the eagles facing left.

True, and I noted that when I originally made it for this thread a few years ago, but the main focus was the changes in grades and titles.

 

Justin B.

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The term "Corpsman" has nothing to do with being assigned to the Marines. They are "Corpsmen" because they are members of the US Navy Hospital Corps. They were all Pharmacists Mstes, and also all Corpsmen

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The term "Corpsman" has nothing to do with being assigned to the Marines. They are "Corpsmen" because they are members of the US Navy Hospital Corps. They were all Pharmacists Mstes, and also all Corpsmen

Yeah, pharmacist's mates or non-rated hospital apprentices.

 

According to this Google Ngram, use of the term "hospital corpsman" really took off around WW1. In the citations it looks like the term was used in Navy publications as a catch-all, to include both non-rated HA's and petty officer PhM's. Obviously it was useful to have a generic term that didn't depend on knowing someone's exact rate, so I guess it caught on and of course became shortened to "corpsman."

 

Justin B.

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medalcollector

Guys,

 

Thanks a lot for the lot of great information. This is more than I expected.

 

Although they were wearing the same rating, I'm assuming that the field corpsman were under different command than hospital corpsman. Was there different training for field vs hospital? We're they in different commands? How did that work?

 

Thanks again.

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The term "Corpsman" has nothing to do with being assigned to the Marines. They are "Corpsmen" because they are members of the US Navy Hospital Corps. They were all Pharmacists Mstes, and also all Corpsmen

 

Yes I personally know that info, but some people still don't know that info and I'll just have to explain it all over again.....so thanks for doing it for me! :)

 

It's like the P-14/M-17 Enfields....I just get tired of explaining it every time the subject comes up...

 

LF

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Guys,

 

Thanks a lot for the lot of great information. This is more than I expected.

 

Although they were wearing the same rating, I'm assuming that the field corpsman were under different command than hospital corpsman. Was there different training for field vs hospital? We're they in different commands? How did that work?

 

Thanks again.

. All Corpsmen go through ghe same initial medical training to be come Corpsmen. Then they are sent off for assorted specialty training. Those that are assigned to the FMF ( Fleet Marine Force) then go through field medical training and field training. They then, just like all Vofpsmen are assigned to individual units. Their chain of command is the same as every one else in the unit.

 

When the Marine unit embarks aboard ship, all Corpsmen are assigned yo the ships medical facility (keeping their Marine unit Chain of Command). This is to assist with sick call and such as embarked Matines will go there for treatment. By the same token, communication Personel will be asfigned yo ghe ships communication section to assist in the increased traffic for embarked Marine units, and the books go to the galley.

 

A tour in FMF is just like any other duty assignment for Corpsmen and usually counts as sea duty. Most times, when in Garrison ghey go to the base hospital isles YHEIR unit is going to ghe field, then they will go too. Many Cotpsmen become Corpsmen specifically to Serve with the marines. They can spend their entire career in Marine units. However, while service in FMF is generally voluntary, many Votpsmen are simply assigned for s tour. Most of the Zcorpsmen I knew did not volunteer. They did one tour with FMF and then returned to the fleet. Also interestingly, none of the Corpsmen I knew who had been assigned rather than volunteer, wore Marine uniforms other than in ghe field. Ghey stuck with their Navy uniforms the rest of the time. BTW, all were combat vets with MC, Viet Nam, Panama, Grenada and Desert Storm.

 

I think one of the reasons the name was changed "Officially" to Corpsman after WW 2 was that it is easier to say and write than Pharmacists Mate ( which they really were no longer) , and the Warrant Pharmacist, of which they were "Mates", was dropped

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Corpsman is a beloved name weather in the field with the Marines or or Haze grey and underway, The training may vary a bit but when rounds are incoming and you call for help you are calling the same man.

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It's not at all uncommon for Corpsmen to go back and forth from FMF units to afloat units to hospitals. It's just how they get detailed in the process. My last HMC on my last ship had done three tours with the Marines, back to back, before becoming an IDC on a ship. There was an HMCS who was at the USNA while I was there on staff who I am not certain had ever been on a ship (or he may have been ages before.) The dude was a true STUD...he had been with the Marines and SEALs for the majority of his career. He was even HALO qualified (first time I saw a Corpsman with that...) He looked like a superhero too. And then he had an affair with a midshipman and flushed it all away...sigh... :(

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Sigs and Dave, I have a question. I deployed to the Med IO in 81 on a DD as an HT2 we had a Chief and no LPO. I moved from OSL of Rep2 to OSL Rep5. I was lead DCPO before that and I suppose HT shop LPO That said. there were surgical areas set up in the wardroom, EDF and back aft. I thought

Hmm cool.... we had a Corpsman in each Rep Lkr and folks manning the stations previously mentioned, and we did this with an HM1 and HM3? Hate to say but I did not do that math until this post came up..I suppose that is part of being a TIn Can Sailor. It does not matter if this individual is in the field with the Marines or Haze grey and underway his name is Corpsman and he covers a lot of ground and has the confidence of those under his care on his watch.

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The leading Corpsman on a ship is s qualified IDC (Independant Duty Corpsman). He can preform minor surgeries and dispense some prescription meds etc. ships are srt up with all forts of medical equipment even though during peace time operations there may not be anyone to use them. Plus, if your ship is on the ball, every one is getting First Aid Training regularly and any one can do basics.

 

Dave, you are correct. I knew lots of HMs who bounced back and forth. Some who avoid FMF like an STD, some who wouldn't do anything else. Yeah, it's just a normal part of their duty station rotation. When he rotates duty stations, he could be offered FMF, a carrier or a frigate

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Sigs and Dave, I have a question. I deployed to the Med IO in 81 on a DD as an HT2 we had a Chief and no LPO. I moved from OSL of Rep2 to OSL Rep5. I was lead DCPO before that and I suppose HT shop LPO That said. there were surgical areas set up in the wardroom, EDF and back aft.

 

Kind of funny...I read this last night and understood it. Then it dawned on me...geeze...that's almost pure acronym and Navy-speak! LOL :D (Almost like our own language, sometimes!)

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You're RIGHT!!! I just noticed that ?. It's funny, on other forums and boards, dealing with Naval history, I spend a lot of time "Translating" Navy into civilian ?

 

By the way, everything we've ssid about Corpsmen, while mostly in our time, would have been the same for WW 2 Corpsmen. Get into the Navy, selected due to aptitude for PhOM school, assigned to FMF. If he survived and stayed in the Navy, he would eventually be transferred where needed. Either another Marine unit or some hospital or fleet init

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David is correct. I was just looking at the rate, and didn't notice that disgusting fat parrot on the post 1984 badge. Good catch

 

I assume the same person that designed the pudgy parrot also came up with the motto "A Global Force For Good".

 

 

 

 

Wharf

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One of my favorite weapons in my collection is an sks brought back by an HM1 who was with the 1/9 Marines in Vietnam. He was a three war vet and was wounded at Khe Sanh. I have a lot of respect for a guy on his third war still out there with the mud Marines. (If anyone has a Vietnam era HM1 rating they'd sell, please pm me)

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Glad you guys got it and I did not mean to disrespect any one else but what I said in just over a sentence was equal to at least a paragraph . And yet it is a bit of a math equation gone wrong, We had 3 Battle dressing stations ( the surgical outfitted areas in the Wardroon, Enlisted dining facility formerly known as the messdecks and a smaller space back in the aft section of the ship) which I assumed should have an IDF and assistant and a corpsman in each of the repair lockers. That would be 9 corpsman yet we had 2.

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