A WW2 era(?) Combat Aircrew

[Patchcollector]

Happy Friday all,

I recently acquired this Wing and have this question;would these be considered WW2 era?Sellers pics.

 

Thanks

 

Here is the sellers' description:

 

Vintage original WW 2 US Navy Naval Combat Aircrew wing by H&H Hilborn & Hamburg. This wing is made of metal, and is marked on the back with the H&H symbol and Sterling, also has a name scratched onto the back. very nice feather detail on this wing insignia.

[Steve Brannan]

It looks like a WWII piece to me.

[pconrad02]

Yes, I would consider that to be WWII - and a very nice example!

[pfrost]

I have no opinion or factual knowledge myself, but I have heard for other collectors who I respect that this type of finely feathered wing is actually a later version (perhaps around the KW/to early 60's) than the WWII versions. Either way, it in no way takes anything from this badge, I think.

[MikeK]

Berries and detailed feathers = post-WW2 (1958) design.

 

Nice honest example with great patina though!

 

Regards

Mike

[Patchcollector]

Thanks everyone for all the info!

[5thwingmarty]

The berries and detailed feathers do not mean post WWII design for these wings.  This is a page from a 1944 Naval magazine.

 

[bschwartz]

Digging deep into the site archives for this one Marty.  Very nice find with the 1944 dated magazine article.  Could you post a larger version of the drawn wing from the article?  I had heard the collector lore of the finely feathered wings with berries being post-war as well.  Your magazine sheds some interesting new light on a possibly earlier timeframe.  

 

Thanks, Bob

[MikeK]

See attached

US-Navy-wings.pdf

[The Rooster]

Is that a name scratched into the back ?

RW MAINS ?

[5thwingmarty]

Bob, I just bought my first Naval Aircrew wing so was researching what I could find posted about them and found this old thread.  The magazine was on ebay so when it arrives I will be able to get a better scan of the wing to post in this thread.  When the wing arrives I will post photos of it as well in the other old thread showing the various types of Naval Aircrew wings everyone has found.  It does not have berries or fine feather details but it is different than any other one I could find photos of.

[bschwartz]

Thanks Marty.  I've had this wing in my collection for a long time.  http://www.ww2wings.com/wings/usnavy/aircrew/hhnavycrew.shtml  I've always assumed it was a post-war wing based on the document that MikeK posted and other collector information.  I kept it on the site, along with a Vanguard marked example that has the berries and fine feathering, even though I assumed it was actually post war.  Always toyed with taking them down but if there's a 1944 magazine with a line drawing of the similar design then maybe it opens a door to them being earlier.  Don't really care what the answer is I just want to get to the right answer.  Appreciate your assistance.  

[5thwingmarty]

It will be interesting to see how the picture looks in hand.  To me it looks like an actual photo of a wing, not just a line drawing.  In the other thread about Air Crew wing varieties, to me it looks like the Vanguard wing in the current last post of that thread:

The berries match and the way the rope goes around the anchor and extends below the anchor match.

[5thwingmarty]

Here is a scan of the page,  I still think it is a photo of a wing and not just a line drawing, but it does not really match the Vanguard pattern I thought it did.  The numbers of berries on each side matches, but the wing feathering does not match at all.  It is almost exactly 2" in span like an actual wing would be.

 

[5thwingmarty]

I now believe the wing in the magazine is an H-H and here is a photo of one that was on ebay.  The back looks like the other H-H examples posted.

 

[bschwartz]

Thanks Mel.  That is exactly what the H&H I have in my collection and on the site looks like.  Interesting that it may actually be a period piece.  Sure hard to argue against it with the 1944 magazine article depicting it.  Thanks for bringing this new information to light.  

[5thwingmarty]

Glad to be able to contribute some "new" old documentation.  There are two H-H Naval Aircrew wings on your site, but I don't see this pattern wing there.  Do you happen to have any Blackinton hallmarked Naval Aircrew wings?

[bschwartz]

Mel, you're right!  I was a little too quick on the comparison.  The feathering in the wing you copied from ebay has a center veign in each feather with lines radiating out from that.  The one I have on my site that is in my collection just has hatch marks running from top to bottom in each feather.  So that opens the door back up then to mine being, perhaps, a later pattern.  But it is still interesting to see an air crew wing with berries depicted in 1944.  

 

Unfortunately, I don't ever recall seeing a Blackinton made Naval Crew wing.  I wish I had one if they're out there.

[bschwartz]

Ok, sorry Marty.  I keep calling you Mel.  I have another conversation going with Mel and I'm confusing you now.  I clearly need sleep.

 

[5thwingmarty]

I was guessing you were blending Mel and I, no need to apologize.  Hopefully you got some sleep.  I bought that H-H wing that was on ebay so I can send you photos of it to put on your site after it arrives.  I have another Naval Aircrew wing coming next week I can send photos of too.