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Ranger Tab Question


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#1 gap

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 05:53 PM

When was this combination of 2nd Army/Ranger Tab worn? Is it WW2, post-war, Korean War, Vietnam, modern?  

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#2 vzemke

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 06:06 PM

That combo is WWII.  That style of "RANGER" patch is known to have been worn with at least a few other SSI during WWII, including the 100th Infantry Division. 

 

There is at least one published photo of an instructor at the 2nd Army's Ranger training school wearing this combo during WWII.

 

-Vance



#3 gap

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 06:24 PM

For a WW2 display, what combo would be more likely -- 2nd Army, 100th ID, or other.  



#4 doyler

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 06:40 PM

This (if I recall correctly) was for a Ragner type course here state side.Not sure how much it was actually worn.I have heard there was a Ranger couse done at Camp/Fort McCoy during WW2.

 

You will see the tab worn in conjunction with the 100th Inf as well.

 

I have seen a Ranger certificate as well from the 66th Division(WW2) as well.


Edited by doyler, 13 February 2014 - 06:43 PM.


#5 ABNRANGER1-75

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 07:53 PM

RANGER BATTLE COURSE. Not associated with current Ranger training. I have heard there was one training course held at Camp Butner, North Carolina. Not sure it is true since WWII Rangers did training at Camp Butner (I believe the story confusses the two ranger training events; RANGER BATTLE COURSE verses the traditional Commando style training most ranger organized units participated in early in the war).

100th, 66th, and 2nd Division had a RANGER BATTLE COURSE.

#6 Allan H.

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 07:59 PM

I have only ever encountered this tab with the 2nd Army and 100th Infantry Division. The 2nd Infantry Division wore the skull patch on their left cuff and I cannot say that I have ever encountered an insignia for the 66th Division to denote their ranger training.

Allan



#7 Steverino

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 11:06 PM

I had a co-worker whose father had been in the 143rd Inf, 36th Div in WWII.  She brought in some of his his old military paperwork.  Among them was a certificate from the Ranger course he completed at Camp Otis (as I recall).  In the wording of the certificate it said that the soldier was now entitled to wear the "appropriate insignia."  She had no uniform, and no photos of her dad in uniform so I could never discover what "appropriate insignia" he might have been entitled to wear.  I suppose it could have been this red/white Ranger tab.  I made a copy of the certificate, but now I can't find it.

 

PatchJohnson



#8 irish

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 03:54 AM

If I recall 2nd Army ran a Ranger School At Camp Forrest , Tenn 1943' 44. Had a group many years ago that had a graduation certificate and photos. The certificate had the 2nd Army insignia printed on it.

#9 Tonomachi

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 06:19 AM

Found the previous threads concerning this tab:

 

http://www.usmilitar...sst#entry362016

 

http://www.usmilitar...howtopic=155068



#10 Rakkasan187

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 06:27 AM

I had a co-worker whose father had been in the 143rd Inf, 36th Div in WWII.  She brought in some of his his old military paperwork.  Among them was a certificate from the Ranger course he completed at Camp Otis (as I recall).  In the wording of the certificate it said that the soldier was now entitled to wear the "appropriate insignia."  She had no uniform, and no photos of her dad in uniform so I could never discover what "appropriate insignia" he might have been entitled to wear.  I suppose it could have been this red/white Ranger tab.  I made a copy of the certificate, but now I can't find it.

 

PatchJohnson

 

I too have a certificate from a member of the 141st Infantry, 36th Infantry Division who completed Ranger training. I will pull out his certificate and see what it says. He was later captured at the Rapido River crossing/assault and became a POW for the duration of the war. It was his 21st birthday when he was captured at the Rapido River..

 

Leigh



#11 Steverino

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 07:31 AM

Leigh,

 

Thanks for the back-up on the 36th Div certificate.  I would love to see it.  I'm guessing yours may be easier to find than the copy I have.  Also, have you ever seen any 36th Div paperwork referring to a soldier being awarded "The Blue Star"?

 

PatchJohnson



#12 Rakkasan187

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 07:42 AM

Leigh,

 

Thanks for the back-up on the 36th Div certificate.  I would love to see it.  I'm guessing yours may be easier to find than the copy I have.  Also, have you ever seen any 36th Div paperwork referring to a soldier being awarded "The Blue Star"?

 

PatchJohnson

 

Patch,

 

I will have to check the 201 file I have for the Soldier mentioned above, maybe he was awarded the blue star. I will post the certificate later tonite..

 

Leigh



#13 Rakkasan187

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 05:56 PM

In response to PatchJohnson's  request here are some pictures of a certificate that was awarded to a member of the 36th Division's 141st Infantry Regiment. The Ranger training was conducted at Camp Edwards, Massachusetts.

 

The certificate was printed on brown card stock. I do not have the original in my possession but was granted permission to copy the Soldier's 201 file to include his statements to the red cross after he was released from the POW camps.

 

Leigh

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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#14 Steverino

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 06:41 PM

Rakkasan,

 

Indeed, that is like the certificate like the copy I have.  I said camp Otis.  I mean Camp Edwards.  I knew it was on Cape Cod at least.  So, when you saw this certificate, in your mind, what insignia was being referred to as the "distinctive insignia?"  Were you thinking "DI" or something else?

 

Thanks much for the image.

 

PatchJohnson



#15 Rakkasan187

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 06:48 PM

Rakkasan,

 

Indeed, that is like the certificate like the copy I have.  I said camp Otis.  I mean Camp Edwards.  I knew it was on Cape Cod at least.  So, when you saw this certificate, in your mind, what insignia was being referred to as the "distinctive insignia?"  Were you thinking "DI" or something else?

 

Thanks much for the image.

 

PatchJohnson

 

I was thinking some type of RANGER recognition insignia, not necessarily a tab, but maybe something along those lines. I wonder if there is anything in the 36th Infantry Division unit history?

 

Something else to investigate now...

 

To be continued.... I'm sure

 

Leigh
 



#16 Teamski

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 08:05 PM

That combo is WWII.  That style of "RANGER" patch is known to have been worn with at least a few other SSI during WWII, including the 100th Infantry Division. 

 

There is at least one published photo of an instructor at the 2nd Army's Ranger training school wearing this combo during WWII.

 

-Vance

 

 

Vance, 

 

You know where that photo is?

 

-Ski



#17 vzemke

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 05:08 AM

Ski,

Now that I went out and said it exists, I can't for the life of me remember where I saw it.  I'm fairly certain I'm not just making it up in my mind (I hope!)

 

-Vance



#18 Teamski

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 01:05 PM

Ski,

Now that I went out and said it exists, I can't for the life of me remember where I saw it.  I'm fairly certain I'm not just making it up in my mind (I hope!)

 

-Vance

 

 

As the the famous Ghostbusters once said, "We are ready to believe you!"  ;)

 

-Ski



#19 ABNRANGER1-75

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 05:44 PM

In US ARMY RANGER & SPECIAL FORCES OF WWII by Robert Todd Ross page 46-49 shows Ranger certificates from 66th Division and 81st Inf. Division. It also has 100th Instructor with patch. The skull patch is also presented with a modified 'fort sam houston' example.

#20 ABNRANGER1-75

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 05:54 PM

Furthermore author states, 'In 1943, tbe commanding officer US SECOND ARMY DIVISION launched a short lived Ranger School of two weeks duration, at Camp Forest, Tennessee.'

It goes on to state that the red ranger patch was awarded to those that completed the course. It states further that 'divisional' rangers wore the patch below their respective 'divisional'.

What surprises me the most is that on page 46 it states that it is believed some volunteers of the 2nd and 5th Ranger Battalions during their stateside training wore this insignia before going to Europe. (That is first time I have heard or read that)?

#21 tredhed2

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Posted 16 February 2014 - 08:46 PM

........."on page 46 it states that it is believed some volunteers of the 2nd and 5th Ranger Battalions during their stateside training wore this insignia before going to Europe".

 

"Believed?" Believed by whom? The author? Hardly a ringing endorsement. Is there documentation or other corrorboration for this "belief?" This would be an exceptionally important finding, if it could be proven.     

 

Coupled w/ his other inherently stupid mistake, calling it the "Second Army Division", makes me wonder how he did his research and what other errors are in the book? Mistakes like this compromise the work.


Edited by tredhed2, 16 February 2014 - 08:55 PM.


#22 Wedgehead30

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 01:08 PM

I was recently researching this patch combination and ran across this single page of the AGF newspaper.

 

download.jpg RANGER 001.jpg



#23 Wedgehead30

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 01:09 PM

RANGER 013.jpg



#24 Wedgehead30

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 01:09 PM

RANGER 006.jpg RANGER 010.jpg




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