kfields Posted March 31, 2007 Share #1 Posted March 31, 2007 NOTE: FELLOW FORUM MEMBERS, This topic is split from the original 31 page USMC Marksmanship Badge topic. With recent changes to the forum now containing a separate marksmanship badge subforum, we will gradually be splitting the large catch-all topic into more appropriate independent topics where they can be more easily accessed and referenced. This thread will remain the "catch-all" for annual rifle/pistol engraved qualification badges, however members are not limited to posting their badges here and may feel free to start their own topics for the discussion of other badges. -Brig Here's a named and dated sharpshooter badge. I've been told engraved shooting badges is more of a Marine tradition. Any truth to that? I figured this tradition had pretty much died out. However I purchased this 80's vintage shooting badge and was surprised to see that it was dated, though not named. Is this the qualification date and do Marines still engrave their stuff like this today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt175 Posted April 17, 2007 Share #2 Posted April 17, 2007 Here's a named and dated sharpshooter badge. I've been told engraved shooting badges is more of a Marine tradition. Any truth to that? I figured this tradition had pretty much died out. However I purchased this 80's vintage shooting badge and was surprised to see that it was dated, though not named. Is this the qualification date and do Marines still engrave their stuff like this today? I just got a small grouping of USMC insignia, and there was a Pistol Expert badge with what I thought was a similar marking. I was thinking "Cool! I got a dated one!" So I dug up this thread, because I wanted to compare it with yours, and I was suprised by what I found. My badge has the same OEC2-81 marking on it. Since I think the odds of that are slim, I now believe this is a makers mark, and not engraved by the Marine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad k Posted November 10, 2007 Share #3 Posted November 10, 2007 I got this at a gun show awile ago with some other unrelated insignia for $15.00, I've found a little bit of info on him, he was a marine from 1910-1914 and was in the philipines, he shot himself in 1932 and is buried in Grant Mi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobgee Posted November 10, 2007 Share #4 Posted November 10, 2007 FYI-----This is official engraving. Qualifying with the rifle was a very big thing and also had a pay bonus attched. The Qualifification badges, Expert, Sharpshooter and Marksman all were presented as shown on this fine example. This stopped during WWI and was not resumed to my knowledge. Semper Fi....Bobgee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bayonetman Posted November 10, 2007 Share #5 Posted November 10, 2007 A very nice piece and quite early for Marines. They actually did not adopt these badges officially until about 1912 according to US Marine Corps Marksmanship Badges from 1912 to the Present. However, they were apparently at times issued or at least dated prior to that. I have seen one or two dated back as early as 1907. I have a Marksman bar engraved and dated in the same style, and have looked for years to find the Sharpshooter and Expert badges so marked that I could afford. You did extremely well on this one, I am jealous . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad k Posted November 10, 2007 Share #6 Posted November 10, 2007 thanks guys, I didn't know it was official, i did know that I did good though, the dealer even looked at the back to see if it was sterling before he gave me a price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hudson Posted November 10, 2007 Share #7 Posted November 10, 2007 He enlisted 7 Jun 1909 - he made Corporal Jan. 28, 1913 and got out in June 1913 World War I Draft Registration Cards, 1917-1918 about Charles Arnold Reinoldt Name: Charles Arnold Reinoldt City: Not Stated County: Newaygo State: Michigan Birthplace: Michigan;United States of America Birth Date: 5 Jun 1888 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremiahcable Posted November 11, 2007 Share #8 Posted November 11, 2007 Those are indeed very nice and sought after pieces. Private engraving continued on into WW1 and a bit after from what I've seen. Dirk has a great Marksman badge that is engraved, I'll see if I can con him into posting it. Jeremiah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted November 11, 2007 Share #9 Posted November 11, 2007 Brad: Great find I'll try and post my two....sharpshooter and Marksman from 1912 and 1917 as the engraving is slightly different on my 1912 sharpshooter it may be of interest....also J may add some as well.....Again congrats on a wonderful item! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hudson Posted November 11, 2007 Share #10 Posted November 11, 2007 Here's one I found at an estate sale in 2006: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobgee Posted November 11, 2007 Share #11 Posted November 11, 2007 quote name='Jeremiah' date='Nov 10 2007, 04:50 PM' post='75976'] Those are indeed very nice and sought after pieces. Private engraving continued on into WW1 and a bit after from what I've seen. Dirk has a great Marksman badge that is engraved, I'll see if I can con him into posting it. Jeremiah J- Using the term "Private engraving" suggests that the Marine had this done on his own. This is not the case. The early badges were "awarded" with the engraving in place, done by a higher headquarters. My curiosity piqued, I pulled out a few that I have. Unfortunatelt with the pins they don't scan well and that's my preferred photo method. I have a 1915 Expert and a 1918 Expert; 1911, 1912, 1915 and 1917 Sharpshooter and Marksman w/ 1913 date only, 2 1916s and a 1917. I have a copy of a 1915 USMC Recruiting booklet, which shows among other things, additional Pay for Marksmen of $2.00 per month; Sharpshooter-$3.00 and Expert Rifleman - an additional $5.00 per month.....certainly a significant stipend at the time. The naming of the badges may have had something to do with the pay incentive though I'm not sure. BTW my 1911 & 1912 Sharpshooter badges are nearly identical to Pvt Reinoldt's 1910 badge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted November 11, 2007 Share #12 Posted November 11, 2007 Brad: As promised....not the best image, but this one shows a China Marine's Sharpshooter award for target season 1912. Note how the date is engraved....it would be interesting to see if these were engraved centrally stateside then sent to the winner or if they were engraved locally from existing stocks at each Marine's location......BTW Bob's right on the importance of getting that extra money back then, given how little they got paid they really worked for the ER and it was a source of pride even through the early 1940's (beside as one marine wrote, the award looked good on the uniform when on liberty). BTW it is interesting to note that at the Legation in Peking at least they got their awards almost a year after they qualified.....might be a good case for the "sent from the states" theory vice done locally....wonder what other posts did..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted November 11, 2007 Share #13 Posted November 11, 2007 Here is one I've had for a while.....this dates to Feb 14 1918....no name, just a location (Paris Island with one r) and a date....looking against the Ancestry site "A" Company shot on that date and several men qualified "Marksman". Again, is this a "private" engraving or did the marines drop the name after a certain date.....over to you Bob for ideas and J for other examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted November 11, 2007 Share #14 Posted November 11, 2007 Well thanks to all for the information shared. Perhaps I should add these to my collecting interests Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad k Posted November 11, 2007 Share #15 Posted November 11, 2007 here is the only other named one that I have, it's on an interesting ww2 warrant officers tunic that I will try to post on the uniform section, I haven't got any history on this guy, the name appears to be william c. mullen but inked inside the sleeve looks like miller ,note that the 9 is backwards! also my mistake on the other badge that I posted, it's 1911 not 1910. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Brannan Posted December 22, 2007 Share #16 Posted December 22, 2007 This is the only engraved WWI USMC Expert Rifleman award I have seen but they may be common. I have had this group for 25 years. Engraved on bar is DeWitt C Carpenter and one the suspension wreath is "254 Points June 20th 1918". "US" on one side and "MC" on the other. Anyone else have one of these? Also in the groups is a Good Conduct Medal No. 40432 which is not engraved, WWI Victory Medal and enlisted cap Eagle Globe and Anchor. The marine must not have gone overseas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted December 22, 2007 Share #17 Posted December 22, 2007 Steve: That is a very nice engraved ER....I've got a MM engraved and a SS engraved, both in different styles, but neither is nearly as nice as yours....i like the score added as well....I've not seen that done before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted December 23, 2007 Share #18 Posted December 23, 2007 Steve: That is a very nice engraved ER....I've got a MM engraved and a SS engraved, both in different styles, but neither is nearly as nice as yours....i like the score added as well....I've not seen that done before. DITTO... esp like the range score engraving! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLM Posted December 24, 2007 Share #19 Posted December 24, 2007 Steve, Sorry to be the sand in the ointment, but this shooting badge is much later than WWI. I'm thinking WWII at the earliest, so if it was engraved for or by this Marine, it was done long after the fact. Your badge sports the '03 rifles from what I can see and all of the attributed WWI Expert badges I have owned and still do own have always had Muskets. I don't believe the '03's were added to shooting badges until the 1937 uniform reg changes, and the .30-40 Krag rifles preceded the .03's. If I were to see this grouping for sale today, I would say someone engraved and added the badge to enhance value to the group. If it is an attributed and documented group, I'd say the Marine had a later badge engraved to reflect his shooting abilities. My .02 cents! Dirk - did you find this Marine on ancestory? s/f, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted December 24, 2007 Share #20 Posted December 24, 2007 Gary: He qual'ed ER 20 Jun 18 while at Paris Island....received the badge 27 Jun 18. Middle initial is "E" looks like he spent his time at Paris then out in 1919...seems to have disappeared May 1919 but cant find him past Apr Photo of the ER in the '17 regs shows a Krag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted December 24, 2007 Share #21 Posted December 24, 2007 catch is different for the pin then my WWI as well....maybe he had this done later after he got out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kklinejr Posted July 24, 2008 Share #22 Posted July 24, 2008 I was fortunate that my wife had the nice eye to catch this one via auction. On first look it is a rather unassuming early C-clasp sharpshooters badge, but as it is turned over, it is named and dated. Awarded to Private William L. Grom, USMC on September 20th, 1910, a quick check of the muster rolls both validated the name and date of the badge. William L. Grom enlisted 23 December 1908 and served for three years (1909, 1910, 1911) on the armored cruiser USS West Virginia ACR-5. By December of 1911 he was assigned to the Pacific Coast Recruit District as a recuiter and was promoted to Corporal, then Sergeant. He was discharged 24 December 1912 with a rating of excellent both in character and in fitness. On his discharge he was awarded USMC Good Conduct Medal #3519. (Currently I'm in the process of tracking Grom's other items down.) With these early pieces, it's wonderful how even the small items can reveal so much about the man who wore it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobgee Posted July 24, 2008 Share #23 Posted July 24, 2008 Nice vintage piece. Hope you can find & reunite his other stuff! Semper Fi.......Bobgee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted July 24, 2008 Share #24 Posted July 24, 2008 Nice find Ken, those pre WW1 shooting badges are indeed hard to find with engravings. s/f Darrell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMCR79 Posted August 5, 2008 Share #25 Posted August 5, 2008 Ken, Here is the one I discussed with you Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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