Original WW2 Paratrooper Jump Wings?

[fpicoli]

Hi,

 

i would like some fellow collectors opinion on this paratrooper jump wings.

 

Looks like Robbins Sterling wings, but....

 

If you have any information, please, share. I would apreciate.

 

Regards,

 

Fabio

 

PS: Sorry for the low resolution pictures. Those are the only ones i have.

[doyler]

Look original to me

[Tonomachi]

Good original piece however I always felt that these Robbins sterling pin back paratrooper wings were either post war or WW2 era and continued to be made into the 1950s. The reason for this observation is because I've seen a Master Robbins sterling pin back paratrooper wing with the same indented logo and rear fixings. I've yet to come across a senior wing but since a master wing was manufactured there has to be a senior one out there somewhere.

[triplecanopy]

Good original Robbins wings. They were manufactured by Charles R. Robbins Company of Attleboro, Massachusetts. I believe that these are WWII vintage wings.

I would like to see the master version of these wings as I suspect that the master wreath and star might have been added later as was the practice after the higher ratings were approved in 1950.

[Tonomachi]

Here is a photo of the master level Robbins wing I spoke of. Although the pin is missing you can see where the same egg shaped ball catch is used and the wreath & star looks like it was part of the die and not added afterwards. The indented logo looks the same to me. In addition there is another harder to find Robbins sterling pin back paratrooper wing that I believe to be the WW2 version that has a different hallmark.

[Tonomachi]

Back

[triplecanopy]

Very nice! You are correct, definitely post WWII. Another one for the want list along with the senior. Thanks for the photo.

[rustywings]

I believe Tonomachi is correct in describing this Robbin's hallmark as indicative of being produced in the early 1950's.

 

I've noticed for years many avid airborne collectors believe this winged "R" hallmark was used by Robbin's on their WWII era jump wings...but avid aerial badge collectors are adamant this hallmark was first used in the early 1950's.

 

 

[triplecanopy]

On page 145 of the book, HEROS IN OUR MIDST, there is a photo of an early Robbins hallmark that is different from the flying "R". If anyone has an example of the Robbins Attleboro hallmark that they can share, it would be appreciated.

[Tonomachi]

This isn't the best of photos but this is the Robbins paratrooper wing that I feel is probably a WW2 piece as I've never come across a master or senior level wing with this hallmark which is an incised "Robbins Co Attleboro Mass Sterling". Note that It has the same egg shaped ball catch.

 

 

[rustywings]

That's a nice example of a WWII Robbin's hallmarked jump wings!

[triplecanopy]

Thanks for posting. Beautiful wings.

[triplecanopy]

Here is another example of the earlier Robbins Hallmark. If anyone has one of these available for trade or sale, I would be interested.

 

[triplecanopy]

I recently picked these Robbins Co wings up and wanted to post them here. This is a variety that I was unaware of. It is also clutch back. The wing looks good to me. Anyone else have one or know of senior or master levels of this badge.

[BROBS]

interesting wings! looks like they used the same stamp for the "Robbins Co" but left off the location line.

 

-Brian

[pfrost]

I like the winged R jump wing. I think Russ is correct, the R hallmark for aviation badges seemed to be more than likely used after WWII (1950's time frame). Remember, almost none of the WWII trained pilots would have been qualified for either the senior (much less the Command) pilot rating until around the KW time period anyway.

 

It is also my recollection that someone found the copyright for the winged R hallmark being awarded in the 50's (but I may be mistaken on that)--my recollection was that information came from B-17 John or Cliff.

 

As for the R hallmark on the jump wings, I do seem to recall some discussion that implied that these wings had been found in WWII vintage paratrooper groupings. Maybe Alan H can correct me if I am wrong, but I had always leaned towards the winged R hallmark possibly being found on late WWII vintage jump wings. Still, its not like they drew a line and said "well, its August of 1945, so we're going to change things around and change all the old hallmarks".

 

As for the wing in post #14, I can't be sure, but my sense is that that is a false hallmark added to a post-KW/VN era jump wing to enhance its value. During the peak of the BoB and SPR airborne craze (and perhaps earlier than that), it wasn't uncommon to see clutch back jump wings that had been altered to make them pin back, and for fake hallmarks to be added to increase their value. My sense is that this is what you are seeing here.

 

Patrick

[Allan H.]

I was once having a discussion with Don Burgett, WWII 506th PIR veteran and author of "Currahee!" He had a brother who was a paratrooper and was killed in action during WWII. Don's brother's jump wing was one of these Robbins jump wings with the winged R hallmark. I have spent over 35 years chasing jump wings now and have located these Winged R hallmarked wings in other WWII groupings, so my conclusion is that both the Robbins Attleboro and the Winged R hallmark are legitimate WWII vintage parachute badges.

 

I will also say that my opinion doesn't need to be the only one that matters. I simply believe that the hallmark dates to WWII. Oh yeah, if anyone says they talked to somebody at Robbins about the hallmark and were told 1950's, I can tell you that back in the early 1980's (yes 1980's), I had a number of telephone conversations with the secretary who had been working at Robbins for over 40 years back then. She scoured the Robbins records and couldn't find a specific date when this logo was used. She kept telling me to call back and that she would keep looking. She was a sweet old lady. She never came up with anyone definite. She was also the person that everyone else that I talked to at Robbins told me to talk to. I would guess that she knew her stuff.

 

EDIT- Fabio- the wing is an original. It is up to you to decide whether or not you think it is WWII.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Allan

[fpicoli]

Thank you all for the knowledge shared?

Best regards,

Fábio

[rustywings]

Your Honor, if it pleases the court, I would like to introduce oranges to this discussion about apples! For the sake of friends and fellow collectors sharing ideas, I'd like you to take a look at the use of this winged "R" Robbins hallmark through slightly different eyes...

 

Unlike Paratrooper badges, which have used the same basic design for over 70+ years, commercial carriers like United Airlines frequently changed the style and design of their flight crew badges just about every time they introduced a new airplane to their fleet in the early years. So, following the chronological progression of badge designs and hallmarks is more exacting with certain airline badges than many military badges.

 

Regardless if the manufacturer is producing badges for the Armed Forces, or filling a much smaller order for a commercial airlines, the use of their hallmark or trademark would be essentially the same. From the 1930's through the 1960's United Airlines contracted with the Robbins Company to produce many of their stewardess wings. I believe the hallmarks found on the back of those stewardess wings is relative to dating when the winged "R" hallmark came into play on all of their badges. If I'm wrong, or missing something, please fire away.

 

Russ

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #1. Issued from 1937 through 1940:

 

 

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #2. Issued 1937 to 1945.

 

 

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #3. Issued 1944 to 1951.

 

 

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #4. Issued 1954 to 1957.

 

 

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #5. Issued 1957 to 1963.

 

 

[rustywings]

Back of United Airlines badge #6. Issued 1957 to 1968. (All dates of issue were copied from Stan Baumwald's website: www.stanwings.com).