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English made EGA


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#1 Brian Keith

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Posted 17 March 2008 - 06:30 AM

My buddy dug out this emblem the other day, probably been buried for 10 years, I don't know how long he has owned it, and I told him I ask the experts about it. I didn't realize it was english made until I photographed it. Size is 1 3/8ths inches top to bottom, globe is 11/16ths wide
Thanks in advance. Hope you enjoy seeing it.

DSC_0049.JPG

More photo's to come.
BKW

#2 Brian Keith

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Posted 17 March 2008 - 06:32 AM

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Is this an officer's insignia for the shoulder brade?

BKW

#3 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 18 March 2008 - 04:19 AM

Brian, you have here a very interesting period piece from, in my opinion, dates to the immediate post WW1 or very early 20’s. It was used on the Officers Service undress blouse collar. It combines a number of design elements from the pre & post WW1 period. The appearance (from the photo) of applied continents was typical of the post WW1, however, the general outline of the continents is more typical of the pre WW1 period, as well as the eight parallels of latitude. And the C-clip used here is also prevalent in the pre war years, although not exclusive to those years. Seeing the use of applied continents before the war was an exception. And the emblem size’s you have provided is consistent with uniform reg’s from 1902 thru 1922.

What intrigues me about this specific emblem... the eagle’s configuration and leg outline. They are very consistent with those made during and after the War. Yours is very likely made by Gaunt, there were also two others at that period whom produced emblem... Gourdin and GG Cie. We may not know for a long time who made this one as the hallmark is generic. Someone may someday be able to link the generic hallmark thru its pattern to a maker. Despite its general design links to the pre war period and open clasp, I am inclined to say this is a period original of the immediate post war period. And pleased you have chosen to share it with us, as it will surely become part of the reference section post here: were other examples are shown:

http://www.usmilitar...?showtopic=7966

I hope you will post a photo from the side of the emblem and of the eagle, in much the same manner which you photographed the hallmark. Would also like to know if the contents of this emblem are raised and molded on the globe or truly applied. again Thx for sharing. s/f Darrell

#4 Brian Keith

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Posted 18 March 2008 - 04:34 AM

Thanks Darrell, I was hoping you would give me your thoughts. Yes, the continents were applied, they are held on by two pins. I took the insignia back, but I can get it again and do a couple of other photo's for you. I'm pleased it is of interest.
BKW

#5 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 18 March 2008 - 05:07 AM

but I can get it again and do a couple of other photo's for you.
BKW


Yes if its not of an onconvience to you, we have so few QUALITY photo's in Ref of emblems from this period, esp of the period in question. Yours of the hallmark was superb and may help us someday to understand whom made these. These eagle as stated is of paticular interest... again, thank you for taking the time to share w/ us. s/f Darrell

#6 Brian Keith

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 09:06 AM

more photo's

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BKW

#7 Brian Keith

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 09:07 AM

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#8 Brian Keith

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 09:09 AM

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#9 Brian Keith

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 09:13 AM

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I'm going to have to figure out my camers so I can get better depth of field.
Hope these photo's help.

BKW

#10 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 23 March 2008 - 09:09 AM

DSC_0043.JPG

I'm going to have to figure out my camers so I can get better depth of field.
Hope these photo's help. BKW


Brian, no doubt to me this is a very unique period emblem to WW1 or shortly thereafter. Applied continents using pins thru the globe is a seldom seen technique and we are pleased the owner would let you use it for more photo's. Thank you (and the owner) for your time to share it with us. There is no doubt this will end up in our reference section on French made WW1 collar emblems

Thanks, Darrell

#11 Brian Keith

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Posted 24 March 2008 - 05:02 AM

Glad we could be of service.

"There is no doubt this will end up in our reference section on French made WW1 collar emblems"

You might want to put it in the English made section. There is my sarcasm coming through!

I liked the USMC ID tag you posted in the "dog tag" section. Really neat reuse of a advertising item.

BKW

#12 robert60446

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Posted 25 March 2008 - 01:31 PM

Hi guys,
I’m absolutely thrilled by this piece. If possible, I would like to see more hardware pictures (especially hinge pictures). If I’m correct this EGA maker was involved in post war production of German combat badges…

#13 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 26 March 2008 - 02:28 AM

Robert, check out this area of the EGA reference section: http://www.usmilitar...p?showforum=409 and you will find even more in some of the early threads there as well.

#14 Brian Keith

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Posted 26 March 2008 - 04:35 AM

OK, I'll make some photo's of the pin and catch.
May be a few days.
Glad you all like this piece.
BKW

#15 robert60446

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Posted 26 March 2008 - 03:41 PM

OK, I'll make some photo's of the pin and catch.
May be a few days.
Glad you all like this piece.
BKW

Thanks Brian!

#16 Brig

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Posted 26 March 2008 - 03:44 PM

having looked at this piece many times, I, too, am thrilled by it's unearthing. I wonder how rare it really is, and if there was ever a cover emblem designed to go with it... http://www.usmilitar...tyle_emoticons/default/think.gif

#17 Brian Keith

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 07:21 PM

I will try to make some more photo's in a couple of days. I am pleased you all like it. Wouldn't it stand to reason that if a maker produced the collar insignia, they would make the cap badge also?
BKW

#18 Brig

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Posted 01 April 2008 - 07:21 AM

I will try to make some more photo's in a couple of days. I am pleased you all like it. Wouldn't it stand to reason that if a maker produced the collar insignia, they would make the cap badge also?
BKW


not necessarily. I've never seen a cap version of the WWII Australian made emblems, either

#19 Brian Keith

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 04:32 AM

More photos of catch.

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DSC_0232.JPG

BKW

#20 Brian Keith

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 04:35 AM

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Catch is bent so pin won't fit, but I'm not bending it back. It's not my insignia.

BKW

#21 robert60446

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 05:17 AM

Hi Brian,
Thanks for extra pictures; I think this EGA maker was indeed involved in post war production of Fake WWII German awards. Well, what can I say, right after the war market for German badges was huge, so everyone was scrambling to make few “extra” bucks…;-)

#22 bobgee

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 07:51 AM

Hi Brian,
Thanks for extra pictures; I think this EGA maker was indeed involved in post war production of Fake WWII German awards. Well, what can I say, right after the war market for German badges was huge, so everyone was scrambling to make few “extra” bucks…;-)


Robert - Are you suggesting that this USMC badge marked 'Made in England' was made as a Post WWII fake of a 1920s era EGA emblem? I can't wrap my head around that theory. What do you have to back it up? Most of us EGA collectors here seem to feel that this is a genuine 1920s-made badge and that the maker was very possibly J.R. Gaunt, a most prestigious firm in the U.K. Now their emblems and Hallmarks have often been 'faked' but I have never heard that they repro'd Nazi era badges. I am aware, as a long-ago former TR badge collector myself that U.K. crooks knocked off some very good pieces, back in the 70's especially.

Most USMC insignia was made by a handful of authorized U.S. manufacturers. Foreign-made pieces are unusual. They are mostly Australian, U.K. teens to 1950s, some rare-Chinese 1920s-30s jeweler-made pieces and I have heard of,but have never seen, a post WWII German-made EGA. I'm not sure but it seems like you are looking at these USMC emblem postings as if they are all suspicious. Methinks you have been puzzling over the myriad of fake Nazi-era badges too long. You seem to want to connect these EGA insignia with Nazi-era, post WWII fake manufacturers. We all know there is a lot of paranoia in that hobby. When we question something about EGAs here it's mostly done as a learning technique, i.e. as in Darrell's 'Dirty Bird" thread. As you can see in the EGA reference section there has been a lot of sharing. It often centers on who made what, when?Or, we're showing & sharing some modern-made, audaciously bad, fantasy EGA piece that gets to EBay and we're passing the word. I do think the fake exotic Nazi badge market has pushed a lot of collectors into U.S. collectibles and the fakers have followed. There will always be gullible collectors with lots of $ willing to buy crap they know nothing about and who often seem unwilling to learn.

Your interest in pins & catches and alloys used to make Nazi emblems is interesting but I see little or no connection with EGAs. There are as many different types of pins, catches, screw-posts and types of metals used in legitimate USMC emblems as there are in Nazi-era insignia based on who made them.

My 2-cents? Look, listen & learn on this Forum, my young friend. Then when it comes time for you to shell out the big bucks for a "rare" USMC EGA there will be less chance of you getting burned. http://www.usmilitar...tyle_emoticons/default/thumbsup.gif

Bobgee

#23 robert60446

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 07:54 AM

Robert - Are you suggesting that this USMC badge marked 'Made in England' was made as a Post WWII fake of a 1920s era EGA emblem? I can't wrap my head around that theory.

Bob - I’m saying that this EGA maker was producing fake German Awards after the end of WWII...EGA’s made by this maker are perfectly fine.

#24 bobgee

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 08:02 AM

Bob - I’m saying that this EGA maker was producing fake German Awards after the end of WWII...EGA’s made by this maker are perfectly fine.


And who is that EGA maker? And in what time frame do you mean by "after the end of WWII"?
Bobgee

#25 robert60446

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 08:14 AM

And who is that EGA maker? And in what time frame do you mean by "after the end of WWII"?
Bobgee

Bob, hardware featured on those EGA's could be found on fake German Infantry Assault Badges - marked BSW (BSW mark was used by Brüder Schneider AG from Wien). But BSW marking on fake German Infantry Badges is not important here because it was put there only to deceive. I have no idea who the real maker is behind those fake Infantry Assault Badges, but they have originated in some numbers from England and those were featuring the same type of the hardware as used on EGA’s. So this lead me to conclusion that this EGA maker was involved in some black market activities on the German Awards side…I hope you can follow me here…


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