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Too good to be true?

Started by Sabrejet , Mar 03 2012 07:21 AM

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#26 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:06 AM

But Ian, what does the helmet do and where does it fit in with the other Medals??


The "how to" medals guide is coming soon. Watch this space (not!) :lol:

#27 Chap15

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:07 AM

Nice Photos

#28 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:10 AM

Thank you for posting. Owing to the fact that these are both 100% original WW2 helmets, it provides a great basis upon which to compare our pending purchases. I have always been taken aback by the discussions of the 10 rows of webbing versus 11 rows on the chin strap. Can you expound on that to help me out? It looks like the two examples you posted; one has 10 rows, the other 11.

Thanks


Thank you...and good question! :think: To be honest, I've never been a row-counter myself...haven't got the eyes for it these days!! However, I can say that there were variations in weave, width and colour, so there's no absolute rule of thumb beyond what was most typically encountered.

#29 BILL THE PATCH

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:35 AM

hey sabre, i know of a place in england that still has one of those helmets from the 80's still in the box. i think they want around 250.00 plus s&h, i cannot for the life of me remember the name of the company. maybe you know? if so pm the name. i want to buy it. were you in the states at the time of your helmet purchase's. they look so good i'm drooling.

#30 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:38 AM

hey sabre, i know of a place in england that still has one of those helmets from the 80's still in the box. i think they want around 250.00 plus s&h, i cannot for the life of me remember the name of the company. maybe you know? if so pm the name. i want to buy it. were you in the states at the time of your helmet purchase's. they look so good i'm drooling.



Only £250?! That's steal at today's prices! I'm afraid I don't know who the dealer is Bill...and no, I bought my helmets here in the UK.

#31 Harlan

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:58 AM

Yes, there are authentic mint helmets out there. I've seen a couple of them in person. I wish I owned some like yours.

BUT, compared to the percentage of fakes/rebuilds on the market as apposed to the number of authentic mint items that have been hiding in the woodwork that are still out there; authentic mint items such as your treasures are as rare as the proverbial hen's tooth.

With so much trickery, and outright thievery employed by the preponderance of sellers today who try to pass their counterfeit wares off as authentic through our main source Ebay, where we must rely merely on small computer photos and the anonymous seller's 'good name', I will continue to scrutinize every item as if it's counterfeit until I can convince myself otherwise. With my hard earned, and ever decreasing disposable income at stake, I think it would be foolish for me to do otherwise.

I may only be talking for myself though, and a little sensitive because my own disposable income keeps shrinking at such an alarming pace! :(
(Now you went and reminded me that it cost me $45 to fill up my little economy car last night, and after getting gas the quick stop at the grocery store for the basic milk, bread and eggs totaled $50 and fit into two small plastic bags!)

Regardless, I for one appreciate anyone here who reports a suspicious auction item that I might have been thinking of bidding on, or helping me check an item that I'm not 100% sure of, even if they might appear too cautious. But, as I said, I'm poor these days and must watch my money - If I buy something and it turns out that I spent my money for a worthless counterfeit item so that some scumbag crook hiding behind the virtual protective walls of the internet can make a fraudulent profit, it really hurts.

(Dang it Ian! Why did you need to raise my blood pressure like this on such a lovely, warm, Saturday morning in Texas?) :lol:

#32 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 09:12 AM

Hello Harlan...where've you been "hiding" of late?! ;) Back in the 80s when I began collecting US militaria, the talk was all about Nazi stuff and what a minefield it had become for collectors, especially helmets...double-decal this and single decal that etc. Little did we know that within 20 years the "good guys'" helmets would be subject to the same kind of chicanery! :mad: So, although it's often repeated on the forum, caveat emptor has to be the by-word for US helmet collectors these days, especially when, as you rightly point out, many sales (perhaps the majority?) are now conducted on-line and are decided upon the basis of just a few images on a computer screen. That's why I hope that this thread might be of some help in preventing someone out there being duped in the future? (Nice, sunny spring-like afternoon here too....and your gas is still a lot cheaper than ours BTW!) :o

#33 king802

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 09:54 AM

Nice lids Ian.

I had two helmets from the same source. Both mine have OD7 chinstraps and early liners with bare steel washers. One liner is a Westinghouse and the other an Inland. I'll add a couple of pics to this thread if you don't mind.

Rich

#34 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 10:04 AM

Nice lids Ian.

I had two helmets from the same source. Both mine have OD7 chinstraps and early liners with bare steel washers. One liner is a Westinghouse and the other an Inland. I'll add a couple of pics to this thread if you don't mind.

Rich


Feel free Rich...the more the merrier! :thumbsup:

#35 17thairborne

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 11:48 AM

Thank you...and good question! :think: To be honest, I've never been a row-counter myself...haven't got the eyes for it these days!! However, I can say that there were variations in weave, width and colour, so there's no absolute rule of thumb beyond what was most typically encountered.

I have an old swivel bail helmet in OD7. I had been told that a 10 row chin strap was post war, but then again there are those who say anything on a helmet that is OD7 is post war. Its always hard to sort out the various Rules of Engagement, if there really are any hard and fast rules! In any case, your display of the OD7 strap bolsters my confidence in my helmet, which I've owned since '90. (Dang...that was 22 years ago age we getting Old? :blink: )

#36 ccmax

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 12:33 PM

Great photos Ian. :thumbsup:

#37 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 12:39 PM

Great photos Ian. :thumbsup:



Obrigado! :thumbsup:

#38 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 12:39 PM

I have an old swivel bail helmet in OD7. I had been told that a 10 row chin strap was post war, but then again there are those who say anything on a helmet that is OD7 is post war. Its always hard to sort out the various Rules of Engagement, if there really are any hard and fast rules! In any case, your display of the OD7 strap bolsters my confidence in my helmet, which I've owned since '90. (Dang...that was 22 years ago age we getting Old? :blink: )


Yup!! :crying:

#39 ccmax

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 12:50 PM

Topic pinned.

#40 king802

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:21 PM

One of the two Mint swivel bail helmets i have. Both are a mix of late war and early war items. Both have OD7 chinstraps with early raised bar hard wear. Front seam Maganese rim.

OD7 Chinstraps were used in WW2. I have an id'd 80th Division Fixed bail with OD7 chinstraps.

Picture_001.jpg

Rich

#41 king802

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:22 PM

Mint early liner.

Picture_002.jpg

Rich

#42 Sabrejet

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:39 PM

Just like mine Rich. We must have used the same source...CG?! ;)

#43 Justin

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 08:15 PM

Those are both great examples Ian, :thumbsup:

#44 Harlan

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 09:03 PM

Holy Cow, these are some outstanding helmets! I'm happy you started this thread, Ian. Everyone has their own interests, but I really appreciate any gear that's still in mint condition after all these years, and I find late WWII helmets as interesting and desirable as anything you can collect.

Hello Harlan...where've you been "hiding" of late?! ;)

Hi Ian! Sorry I fell off the map. I've been through a computer nightmare the likes I haven't seen in years. It appears it was probably a virus, but we're not sure. I'm seriously careful where I go on the internet, don't open forwarded 'joke' emails etc, and have been buying the newest (expensive) Norton suite every year, but something happened. Too long to go into details, but the full Norton 5 suite couldn't find it at all when things started going bad, and my computer finally just shut itself down and wouldn't boot. The virus(?) disabled the DVD drive and there was no way to enable it again, so there was no way to boot from the Norton disk or even the factory recovery disks. I couldn't even boot into 'Safe' mode. I usually repair my own stuff but had to give up and take it to a pro. I had to start over from scratch with a new hard drive and new operating system. Worst of all, I hadn't backed things up for a while and I lost a lot of data, especially photos - I haven't had any issues in so many years I became complacent. Hard learned lesson.

My old IT buddy who owns the computer shop now told me that he's seen three other computers with the same symptoms over the past couple of weeks, and whatever it is, it's bad. He didn't have anything good to say about Norton either, but sometimes a new virus can beat anti-virus programs to the punch. I guess sometimes the bullet just has your name on it. :( Regardless, I've lost all confidence in Norton but don't have a clue what to use - I used to be a semi-geek in younger days when I was attached to the IT group at work and had to deal with customer networks, but I haven't even read a computer forum in a couple of years. In my old age, I've gotten the same with computers as I am with cars now - I just want to do the basic maintenance and have it run when I start it.

#45 Jack's Son

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 09:34 PM

Ian,
Another of your fine threads has been pinned.....GOOD JOB!! :thumbsup:

#46 Sabrejet

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 03:10 AM

Holy Cow, these are some outstanding helmets! I'm happy you started this thread, Ian. Everyone has their own interests, but I really appreciate any gear that's still in mint condition after all these years, and I find late WWII helmets as interesting and desirable as anything you can collect.
Hi Ian! Sorry I fell off the map. I've been through a computer nightmare the likes I haven't seen in years. It appears it was probably a virus, but we're not sure. I'm seriously careful where I go on the internet, don't open forwarded 'joke' emails etc, and have been buying the newest (expensive) Norton suite every year, but something happened. Too long to go into details, but the full Norton 5 suite couldn't find it at all when things started going bad, and my computer finally just shut itself down and wouldn't boot. The virus(?) disabled the DVD drive and there was no way to enable it again, so there was no way to boot from the Norton disk or even the factory recovery disks. I couldn't even boot into 'Safe' mode. I usually repair my own stuff but had to give up and take it to a pro. I had to start over from scratch with a new hard drive and new operating system. Worst of all, I hadn't backed things up for a while and I lost a lot of data, especially photos - I haven't had any issues in so many years I became complacent. Hard learned lesson.

My old IT buddy who owns the computer shop now told me that he's seen three other computers with the same symptoms over the past couple of weeks, and whatever it is, it's bad. He didn't have anything good to say about Norton either, but sometimes a new virus can beat anti-virus programs to the punch. I guess sometimes the bullet just has your name on it. :( Regardless, I've lost all confidence in Norton but don't have a clue what to use - I used to be a semi-geek in younger days when I was attached to the IT group at work and had to deal with customer networks, but I haven't even read a computer forum in a couple of years. In my old age, I've gotten the same with computers as I am with cars now - I just want to do the basic maintenance and have it run when I start it.



Uh-oh! Just renewed my annual Norton subscription!! :w00t:

#47 Sabrejet

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 03:11 AM

Ian,
Another of your fine threads has been pinned.....GOOD JOB!! :thumbsup:



Thank you JS. :thumbsup:

#48 ken88

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 04:39 AM

Uh-oh! Just renewed my annual Norton subscription!! :w00t:


Just a tip: try AVG free. It's free and beats Norton to the bone!

What I find very interesting, is that these helmets were delivered to the front complete, ready to wear. Or did you guys add the neck nape etc.?
Thought it would be only the shell and liner in the crate, and that the soldier had to add sweatband, chin strap and neck nape himself?

Very interesting thread indeed!

#49 Sabrejet

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 04:44 AM

Just a tip: try AVG free. It's free and beats Norton to the bone!

What I find very interesting, is that these helmets were delivered to the front complete, ready to wear. Or did you guys add the neck nape etc.?
Thought it would be only the shell and liner in the crate, and that the soldier had to add sweatband, chin strap and neck nape himself?

Very interesting thread indeed!


Good question Ken. They were crated but maybe "assembled" pre-sale?!

#50 General Apathy

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 09:12 AM

Both helmets came from the same batch...a sealed crate of WW2 production helmets found at a National Guard armory and which were released for sale to collectors in the late 80s. Both have been in my possession since then. (I won't say how much I paid for them as I don't want to upset you! :lol: )

They are in mint condition...I still have the cardboard packaging. Both are front seam, swivel loop McCords (oval spot-welds on rim) One has OD#3 webstraps, the other, green OD#7 webstraps.


Hi Ian, I also bought one of these unused swivel bail helmets probably around the same time as you and definitely from the same source :thumbsup: . Almost seems like a lifetime away since then. :lol: :lol:

Good topic you started.

ken



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