Jump to content

Thoughts on this theatre made usmc bowie knife


ArchangelDM
 Share

Recommended Posts

Hi Guys,

well im looking for a nice theatre made fighting knife and i have seen this example, i am told its a solid very well made theatre knife probably made in the pacific theatre. Im told they were made by the ships smithys and where hand made for a price. That price was usually loot and other belongings of a dead japanese soldier.

Im not to good on knives but this looks good at $145, at 14inches overall its one of the biggest ive seen. Comes from a very very trustworthy seller. Is this the piece i need for my usmc mannequin ????

 

Thanks in advance

 

Dean C

post-8861-1314043877.jpg

post-8861-1314043887.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree its a nice handmade theatre type knife but what makes this USMC????

 

 

Well i havent seen alot of them pictured in the eto and larger knives were normally carried by the troops fighting in the hotter more thickly covered theatres of war for foliage and tree cutting. Im told the usmc carried alot of these types of knives in the japanese islands. Then again it could just be a huge fighting knife rather than a machette type of theatre knife for cutting foliage.

Also any ideas of a scabbard i could pair it with ? , im thinking a cut down machette case it has a 9" blade

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree its a nice handmade theatre type knife but what makes this USMC????

I was getting ready to ask the same thing before I scrolled down and saw you had.

 

Serrations would have been an unusual addition for a WW2 theater knife...how does seller explain the provenance of the knife?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was getting ready to ask the same thing before I scrolled down and saw you had.

 

Serrations would have been an unusual addition for a WW2 theater knife...how does seller explain the provenance of the knife?

 

 

"HUGE Theater made Bowie Knife. 14 inches overall with a 9" blade. Great fighting knife for a USMC display"

 

Is the description

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"HUGE Theater made Bowie Knife. 14 inches overall with a 9" blade. Great fighting knife for a USMC display"

 

Is the description

 

It's been said over and over; (Buy the knife and not the story)!!

 

I agree with others that over all it shows many signs of a nicely produced theater knife.

 

I also agree that the serrations would be unusual for a knife of this period.

 

A problem with theater knives is that it can be very hard to determine if they come from the desired period and location or from a high school shop class.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's been said over and over; (Buy the knife and not the story)!!

 

I agree with others that over all it shows many signs of a nicely produced theater knife.

 

I also agree that the serrations would be unusual for a knife of this period.

 

A problem with theater knives is that it can be very hard to determine if they come from the desired period and location or from a high school shop class.

 

 

There is no story to the knife but thanks for the input.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is no story to the knife but thanks for the input.

Well, it might be short, but the seller's implication that it is a theater made knife is in itself a story.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cool thanks for the input guys, think I'll give it a miss and wait for a knife that has a little more background. Then I will be more sure on it's past.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cool thanks for the input guys, think I'll give it a miss and wait for a knife that has a little more background. Then I will be more sure on it's past.

 

Dean,

 

That's a good move. It's a very handsome knife (wish it didn't have the serrations), but it's going to be tough to find a matching period scabbard for a 9" blade. And it won't be cheap, which is going to make the rig more expensive than what is worth.

 

BTW, do not make assumptions about no large theater knives in the ETO. They had them in both theaters. See below.

 

ETO

 

post-70-1314064650.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dean,

 

I agree with what the others have said. I have been collecting knives for a few years now (including some nice theater knives) and I have found that reference books can be invaluable. They are well worth the investment and can offer a many-fold return on your investment if they educate you enough to avoid spending a high dollar amount on knives not worth their asking price.

 

For example, if you want to start collecting theater knives you might consider picking up the following book - http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...howtopic=117088

 

Tim

 

P.S. - I have no connection to the seller of the theater knives book.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, also agreed that it is a fine looking knife.

Those serrations kinda jumped off the page, for me, too. They would be quite uncommon from WWII period.

 

While that brass guard is similar to those found on many Bowies, the blade design is what I would refer to as simply a clip point; albeit a fairly lengthy one. A Bowie style blade is normally significantly wider, and often incorporates a mid-range 'swell', behind the clip point.

 

The knife, otherwise, does bear a lot of resemblances to many theatre knives. It would be most difficult to date it, or to necessarily assign it a military provenance without further documentation.

 

My understanding of the presently used term "theatre knife" encompasses knives made in/near 'conventional' combat theaters as well as those made in the homefront shop for Servicemen. I have read a newspaper account involving a high school shop project in Texas, during WWII, that produced a fairly large number of these type knives. There was so much demand, that adults came in at night for the 'second shift'.

There were many, many made by the individual craftsman, as well, with a wide spectrum of attributes.

 

I have one that I can personally document that I posted here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Those serrations kinda jumped off the page, for me, too. They would be quite uncommon from WWII period.

Agree. The only theater knives that I remember with anything like that were made from saw blades. The ones on this knife appear that were added to the blade by the maker, or some else later on.

 

My understanding of the presently used term "theatre knife" encompasses knives made in/near 'conventional' combat theaters as well as those made in the homefront shop for Servicemen. I have read a newspaper account involving a high school shop project in Texas, during WWII, that produced a fairly large number of these type knives. There was so much demand, that adults came in at night for the 'second shift'.

There were many, many made by the individual craftsman, as well, with a wide spectrum of attributes.

DS, that is correct. I forgot to mention what used to be called "shop knives" before the Wrights coined the term "theater knives," which include the shop knives. Thanks for adding that to the discussion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The point about serrated blades being rare on knives made during WWII is well taken. One of the few knives I can think of that have a serrated edge on top near the hand guard are a variant of the EGW knife.

 

serratedEGW.jpg

 

I also learned something new about theater knives in this thread :thumbsup:. I was unaware about the manufacture of these knives in high school machine shops here in the states. I was under the mistaken thinking that they all were made shipboard or "in theater".

 

Thanks for the continuing education.

 

Tim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My understanding of the presently used term "theatre knife" encompasses knives made in/near 'conventional' combat theaters as well as those made in the homefront shop for Servicemen. I have read a newspaper account involving a high school shop project in Texas, during WWII, that produced a fairly large number of these type knives. There was so much demand, that adults came in at night for the 'second shift'.

There were many, many made by the individual craftsman, as well, with a wide spectrum of attributes.

DS, that is correct. I forgot to mention what used to be called "shop knives" before the Wrights coined the term "theater knives," which include the shop knives. Thanks for adding that to the discussion.

You're welcome GB.

I would personally consider knives made by John Ek, Frank Richtig, "Bo" Randall, and several other famous makers of that period (and beyond) would be included in the notion of "theatre knives". This group of more well-known makers obviously were responsible for much more production than the few individually shop-crafted knives (or "benchmade", as they were also once referred to, presumably before becoming a trademarked name).

In support of WWII Troops, it is known that many of these more established custom knifemakers, of the time, provided many of their knives, at no cost, to any U.S. Serviceman deploying to a combat theater.

 

While the term "theater knives" seems to presently include a rather broad spectrum, perhaps a better "popularly" used classification system of groups and sub-groups, of these types of knives, will enter our "common" collector vernacular.

 

 

Tim,

The extent of homefront involvement/supply of desperately needed early wartime knives is really something to marvel.

There are the more well-known "drives" for many items necessary for the War effort; furthermore, the rallies supporting our Service Members from Stateside, even for individual equipment requirements, served to bring the country together in one vast, united front.

 

Our good friend, Forum member, and mentor, Frank Trzaska, touches on the "Crozier Tech H.S. knife" on his site.

He wrote an in-depth article entitled "Knives and Schools: Yesterday & Today", which appeared in the April 2003 edition of KNIFE WORLD.

 

Regards,

Don.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Your knife may have been made on an airbase or carrier shop for pilots or aircrew. You have aluminum, copper, brass and aircraft plexiglass. Looks like a light but strong knife to me. The serrations would help you cut through heavy straps or aircraft skin much quicker. Not a bad survival knife as well. I like it!

 

 

The Wharfmaster

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In Peace and War. US Merchant Marine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

THEATER KNIVES WHETHER ARMY OR MARINES A LOT OF TIMES ARE HOMEMADE AND THE HANDLE LOOKS LIKE A TYPICAL HUNTING KNIFE THAT A GUY BROUGHT TO WAR. A VERY NICE LOOKING AND WELL DONE PIECE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also learned something new about theater knives in this thread :thumbsup:. I was unaware about the manufacture of these knives in high school machine shops here in the states. I was under the mistaken thinking that they all were made shipboard or "in theater".

 

Tim,

 

As a matter of fact, some purist collectors do not accept without provenance a theater knife as made during the war because a number of HS machine shops continued to make them for years after the war. By the way, not all theater knives were pretty or well done. This one for example has to be one of the ugliest ones I've ever seen. Made no doubt by an aspiring plumber in the service... :lol:

 

post-70-1314153467.jpgpost-70-1314153480.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

These two were from a navy vet.By comparing the area these were bought in and the name on the scabbard I found out he was on a PT boat in the pacific

 

post-342-1314157337.jpg

 

 

post-342-1314157417.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have posted all of these in the past but wanted to add them here to show the various styles can be endless

 

The gladiator style large knife is one of my favorites.Has a great feel to it and its very heavy but has a good balance to it.

 

 

post-342-1314157664.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ron,

 

A real sharp lookin' group of knives! :thumbsup:

 

Interesting that the set owned by "LYONS" appears to have sheaths made by the same person. Is the stitching different SPI, as photo makes it look?

Wonder if the knives were made by the same individual.

 

I especially like that gladiator and the two daggers under the Bowie.

Heck, they're all very cool!

 

Regards,

Don.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...