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North China Marines


Dirk
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Well yesterday afternoon I had the pleasure of being invited to stop in to the North China Marine reunion in Fredricksburg, Va......This event honors the Marines who were captured on 8 Dec 1941 at Peking, Chinwangtao, and Tientsin. Although there are only a handful left, they meet every year. Because I have been in contact with several of them over the past few years I was asked if I would like to come to come down and say hi. Although I was only there for a few short hours, I was able to talk to several of them and listen as they conducted a conference call with several others who were unable to attend. For several days prior they had been going up to Quantico to the new museum and to see a marker on the post erected in their honor. According one of them the Quantico Marines really made them feel welcome. Although I took a portion of my collection for their review, the best part for me was standing in the middle of them and listening to their stories based upon a 1928 blueprint of the post that was given to me several years ago. One man was only a small boy when he was evacuated from the legation, but remembered when the large gates of guard post #2 were closed at night a glass painting his mother had hung came crashing down. He also remembered the marines made him a drum out of cigar box that he played alongside the Marines as they raised and lowered the flag each day. Then the Chief cook told the story of burning papers in the kitchen just prior to and after the surrender at the Legation, also another dependent showed a picture of the Marines surrendering to the Japanese that no one had seen before, and many more tales of trips around China, parties and those little stories that never make it into the history books but made this such a great story. I didn't take but three pictures but here is Mr Darr and Mr Biggs (the author). Thankfully the Marines Oral History Project will continue to capture their stories.

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Here's an excellent website dedicated to the North China Marines.

 

http://www.northchinamarines.com/index.htm

 

The father of a boyhood friend, North China Marine Brig General James D McBrayer USMC (ret) , passed away last year. He was one of just a handful of Marines who escaped from the Japanese.

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Thanks Greg! The site maintainer was there and I finally had a chance to meet him face to face. Macbrayer's story is indeed fantastic (it is referenced in several books) and would make a great thread if you have any memories of him! Dirk

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Dirk,

I first met Colonel McBrayer in 1961. He was the father of a friend I met in the 7th grade and I used to idolize the man. Althought I saw a good bit of him until he moved to South Carolina in the 1980's he never went into any detail concerning his experiences as a POW other than to say one day he was going to write a book. He finally did in 1995, "Escape" but it took me until just recently to finally obtain a copy.

 

What sparked my interest in the North China Marines was picking up one of the pre WW2 Phila Depot made map cases on which was stencilled "G W Newton". Doing some research on him I learned he was George W Newton who was a North China Marine who, like Col McBrayer, went on to have a successful career as a Marine officer. When I found the website and saw McBrayer's name on it I finally started putting together the story of what happened to them in WW2. Unfortunately, by this time James McBrayer had suffered a stroke. In 2002, I drove to Birmingham where he and his son both lived partly to see John but also hoping to see his parents. But they weren't up to having visitors at this point. They both passed away over a year ago. I wish I'd been more into military history in my younger days and taken the time to ask questions.

 

The North China Marines paid a heavy price for their being left in China by the US State Dept. In addition to the injuries they suffered at the hands of their captors many had to leave the service prematurely due to health issues. Plus most had their careers impacted. I remember Col McBrayer being passed over for Brig General because of his lack of combat experience. So basically he was held back because he was a prisoner of war. Seemed like a raw deal to me at the time. However, several years ago, he uncovered an old written order stating that he would be advanced in rank one grade upon his retirement. I guess somebody finally decided to do the right thing. So he finally got his star shortly before he died.

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Greg: Thank you for the excellent update....although you may have not had the chance to "interview" him you were lucky to have known him in life. I agree, leaving those men in China was a very bad State Dep idea...much pain for little gain....one of the moving things I heard yesterday was toward the end of the phone conference was one distant end Marine thanking all his buddy's for all they did for him....it is hard to picture what these men went through no matter how many books I may read on the subject.

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Greg: Thank you for the excellent update....although you may have not had the chance to "interview" him you were lucky to have known him in life. I agree, leaving those men in China was a very bad State Dep idea...much pain for little gain....one of the moving things I heard yesterday was toward the end of the phone conference was one distant end Marine thanking all his buddy's for all they did for him....it is hard to picture what these men went through no matter how many books I may read on the subject.

 

I can't comment on what sort of Marine officer he was, but my memory of him was he was an all around nice guy. After he retired from the Marine Corps in the mid 1960's he went back to school and earned his master's degree. Then went to work as an instructer in political science at Ga State University. He went on to earn his Phd and retired from teaching as a full professor. So the man had two successful careers.....not too shabby. He looked every bit the Marine officer, especially in his dress whites, but off duty he was very laid back and liked being the good ole boy from small town Texas.

 

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I just did a google search and found a newspaper article about him written around the time I went there in 2002. No wonder he wouldn't let me come visit. He looked awful and it've been tough seeing him like that.

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  • 2 months later...

Hi, My good friend Don Dull is a North China Marine, but post-WWII. However, he was a friend of Terry Kirk, USMC, who was at Chinwangtao when that unit surrendered. Mr. Kirk wrote a book titled The Secret Camera about the time he spent as a POW in Japan. Kirk also wrote a book of fiction titled The Dragon's Tooth, about what he wished had happened to the Chinwangtao Marines. Anyway, Don Dull rents his home from Kirk's stepson Larry, located on the Calif./Oregon border. Larry also owns Kirk's horse ranch near Santa Rosa, Calif., a few miles from where I live. After he retired from the Marine Corps, Kirk studed English at Santa Rosa Junior College.

 

Best wishes, Jim

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teufelhunde.ret

Hey guys, just want to add a thought here... you keep leaving me wanting more! These personal accounts are as good as the oral histories themselves. And of course the foto's... just think these foto's that have been posted throughout the forum my someday rival the History & Museums collection in variety and depth. Great thread... look forward to more......! s/f Darrell

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Darrell: On the positive side after looking through several collections at Quantico on Thursday and the NA last year I think we have better stuff on the forum for the Legation Guard 1910-1913, but Quantico just got in a large donation that has some amazing stuff that really rounds out those years for me. As well, they have a great album from 1916-17 that makes a fantastic story in itself....I hope to do a post on that as well.

 

I'll probably post in the photo section a thread based upon a series of interviews I did last year with a Shanghai/Peking Marine that I posted on the WAF...it has no narration, only his words and his photos from his album....what i like was he was able to recall the events independently and then I found they matched photos in his album...even though he has been blind for a number of years.

 

I am also continuing to interview China marines where they can be found....I have a series of running interviews that I've been doing over over the past two years that has really helped me understand what was going on over there. Lastly, there is another China marine from the early 30's that myself, and a man who is making a documentary on China marines have been hooked up...we hope to speak to him jointly in early Jan.

 

Dirk

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