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Custer's Last Fight


rufus_firefly
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rufus_firefly

This was given to me by an uncle who saved it from a bar in McCook Ne, which, I presume, closed due to prohibition. The uncle was a WWI vet. I have had it for 45 - 50 years. One of the best copies I have seen. The original was lost when the officer's club at Ft. Bliss burned down. Sorry about the glare.

 

Don

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Classic rendition of the hero Custer being shown as the last man standing. And, from the research that has since been done, far from an accurate rendition.

 

I'd have to dig, but I believe these sell for a good price. It has a triple appeal... Western Collectors, Beer, Bar and Alcohol Memorabilia Collectors and of cours Militaria Collectors. Anytime you have a cross appeal like that, the price goes up.

 

Looks like it is in pretty good shape with little fading or staining. Great item... thanks for sharing.

 

I am curious who the character in buckskin is standing towards the lower center. It doesn't look like the depiction of an Indian, but the Indians don't seem to be bothered by whoever that is supposed to be. Very odd.

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Don, I think Budweiser gave those out to liquor outlets for years. Neat pieces in my humble opinion. According to almost all known accounts of the battle, these BUD prints were, shall we say, were "sensationalized" to make Custer look like a hero. Not really the way I see him.

 

P.S. It was good to see you at the show this a.m. I hope the trip home was good for you.

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rufus_firefly

The first error I would point out is that no one, with one exception, carried a saber. It wasn't G A Custer as shown in this picture. I believe he had 1 or 2 English revolvers. He also had had his hair cut fairly short at the start of the campaign. I haven't visited the battlefield for many years but I have always thought that the artist at least portrayed the terrain accurately, more or less. This image has always hindered my understanding of the battle. There was a lot more to it than is shown in the picture. If you visit don't stop first at Last Stand Hill. Drive first to the Reno/Benteen site then work your way back to the Custer site. If you go in the summer watch for rattlesnakes. The Reno Inquiry is available on line. I saw an original copy for sale about a year ago from an antique book site. Kind of pricey. I also have a small collection of Custer books gathered over the years. I need to get some of his as well as those written by his wife. If anyone is interested I will publish a list of what I have. Suggestions for additions are always welcome.

 

Don

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If I recall correctly, the artist did visit the site... but that is about the only thing he got right.

 

I looked on the web to see if I could find a critique of the painting, and this is as close as I could come. However, the article also mentions that if anyone is looking for a modern copy, they are being sold by the Custer Museum as a benefit.

 

http://www.custermuseum.org/Battlefield%20...20memorials.htm

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  • 2 weeks later...

There are 2 versions of this print. The original has one of us scalping a blue coated pony soldier and it was found to be to cruel and violent for display so he was either removed or changed, I can't remember which. I had a large one of these I aquired out in AZ back in the early 90's. It was the 1st type, but has some damage to it. It was rather large too. I always like the print.. Yours in much nicer than mine was.

 

Fins...

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I am curious who the character in buckskin is standing towards the lower center. It doesn't look like the depiction of an Indian, but the Indians don't seem to be bothered by whoever that is supposed to be. Very odd.

 

 

Why, that is Mule Skinner, Dustin Hoffman of course, didn't you see the movie, Little Big Man? ;)

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Why, that is Mule Skinner, Dustin Hoffman of course, didn't you see the movie, Little Big Man? ;)

 

Ya know... I need to Netflix that and watch again from beginning to end. I saw it years ago ... it was one of the first "anti-hero" movies that I saw that challenged the conventional view of history. Funny and disturbing at the same time.

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Greg Sebring

I have quite a few books about Custer and as a matter of fact, the horse (Don Juan) he rode in the Grand Review immediately after the Civil war is buried less than a mile from my House. I was also a good friend of the late Dr. Lawrence Frost of Monroe, Michigan who authored many a book about G.A.C. This depiction was a very popular wall hanging in many saloons way back. Originals go for big $$$ and there are many reproductions out there. Custer was very audacious and arrogant, but he was also given a bum steer in many ways. He was not the bumbling idiot history has painted him to be. He is a fascinating subject to read about and here is a site where you can learn more if interested:

 

http://www.thelbha.org/home.shtml

 

Greg

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rufus_firefly

Greg,

 

I did check out your link. Thanks. About this print - it is an original. I can remember it hanging in my uncle's basement in the mid 1950's. The character in buckskin is identified in small print on the border below the figure as a "halfbreed". Who knows where the artist got the idea for this. Just to the right another figure is identified as Tom Custer. As I recall from my last visit to the battlefield the marker for Tom Custer is behind the artist's view on the other side of the road leading to the Reno/Benteen site. the picture has several examples of what can only be described as artist's license. I don't think anyone would stop in the middle of a battle to collect a scalp and, at any rate, most the scalping was done by women, children, and old men after all the soldiers had been killed. On the right side there is a depiction of a squaw killing the wounded, true, but not before the battle ended. As graphic as the images of soldiers being scalped seem in reality these are tame. Many of the bodies were dismembered and otherwise mutilated. I have seen Indian pictures of the battle with heads, arms, and legs laying about the battlefield.

 

Custer is fascinating character. Had he lived he would be as familiar as George Crook or Nelson Miles to most people. He certainly was not the bumbling idiot it has become popular to depict. There was an idiot that day, a drunken one - Marcus Reno, and another who failed to carry out a written order - Frederick Benteen.

 

I have often wondered what happened to the 200+ Springfield carbines and pistols the Indians captured that day. Perhaps some are still in the Pine Ridge today, passed from generation to generation.

 

Don

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I have often wondered what happened to the 200+ Springfield carbines and pistols the Indians captured that day. Perhaps some are still in the Pine Ridge today, passed from generation to generation.

 

Don

 

The indians were good at taking rawhide and wrapping the wood and adding decorations to them. There are two examples of such rifles at a local antique store where I live.

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I have quite a few books about Custer and as a matter of fact, the horse (Don Juan) he rode in the Grand Review immediately after the Civil war is buried less than a mile from my House. I was also a good friend of the late Dr. Lawrence Frost of Monroe, Michigan who authored many a book about G.A.C. This depiction was a very popular wall hanging in many saloons way back. Originals go for big $$$ and there are many reproductions out there. Custer was very audacious and arrogant, but he was also given a bum steer in many ways. He was not the bumbling idiot history has painted him to be. He is a fascinating subject to read about and here is a site where you can learn more if interested:

 

http://www.thelbha.org/home.shtml

 

Greg

 

I waded my way through "Son of the Morning Star" a couple of years ago. Bumbling idiot... no. Eccentric, brash and extreme in behavior might be more appropriate. And he certainly acted beyond the scope of his orders, which lead to his final demise.

 

The book is written on a scholarly level, and actually reads like a series of college lectures rather than a narrative. But the details about operations and daily life in the 7th Cavalry on the plains is fascinating. The climax is of course the Battle of the Little Big Horn, but the book draws very nicely from both Army and Native American accounts. It is worth the read for anyone interested in this period.

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Greg Sebring

If one ever wonders about Custer's military savy, just look at how he personally led four Regiments of Michigan Cavalry against Jeb Stuart's whole Cavalry Corp east of Gettysburg and "whooped' them soundly. Had he not carried the day then, the Gettysburg battle likely would have had a different outcome. As for his Indian tactics, Up until that point of time when U.S. Troops engaged them, the Indians would always scatter in all directions making it impossible to deal a crippling blow. They would later reunite to keep their tribes intact. At the LBH, Custer's surprise along with the vision Sitting Bull had about the coming battle, and the massive Indian alliance that had been formed all led to George's defeat.

 

I have seen good copies of the print range between $1,700.00 to $2,200.00 on the net. You are one lucky guy to have an original

 

:thumbsup:

 

Greg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Custer also led the charge at Five Forks, one of the last battles before Appomattox. Unfortunately it was one of the few military tactics he was aware of. It failed to work against the united tribes at the LBH. Of course the Indians changed their tactics at that battle also. Custer, to say the least, was a complex individual. His troopers pretty much hated him. The Army high command were none too pleased with him. Without the intervention of Phil Sheridan,( I think ), he would not have returned to Ft. Abraham Lincoln to lead the 7th to destruction.

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Greg Sebring
Custer also led the charge at Five Forks, one of the last battles before Appomattox. Unfortunately it was one of the few military tactics he was aware of. It failed to work against the united tribes at the LBH. Of course the Indians changed their tactics at that battle also. Custer, to say the least, was a complex individual. His troopers pretty much hated him. The Army high command were none too pleased with him. Without the intervention of Phil Sheridan,( I think ), he would not have returned to Ft. Abraham Lincoln to lead the 7th to destruction.

 

There certainly is no shortage of discussion when it comes to ole George. One has to remember that the enlisted force at the time were the dregs of society. You had immigrants that could barely speak English, There were many criminals that enlisted under assumed names to avoid the authorities, many were illiterate, many were former soldiers of the Confederate States that could find any work, and the list goes on and on. The schism between the Officers and Enlisted Corp was much more severe and harsh discipline was required to maintain order and daily life. Custer biggest problem with Army high command was basically his age. Many of the older Field Grade officers and above resented his rapid rise during the Civil War. Phil Sheridan took him under his wing because Custer did everything he ask of him and made Phil look good to his superiors.

 

The fateful day at the LBH will always be a topic of discussion but one thing can clearly be said and probably agreed to by any Army commander, It hard to defeat your enemy and carry the day when 7/12's of your command don't follow orders and come to your aid. It might have made a difference, maybe not,... something we'll never know.

 

"Garry Owen"

 

Greg

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rufus_firefly

I had not thought about the role jealousy and envy plays in military affairs. It doesn't take long when reading about Custer and the LBH battle to find out the 7th Cavalry was not a happy band of brothers, but was basically divided into 3 groups, friends and family of GAC, officers unfriendly to GAC, and the rest just trying to get along with the other 2 groups. GAC was 36 years of age in 1876. In today's army that would be about right for a lieutenant colonel. GAC had already been a LtC for 10 years which could not have set well with many other officers. Maj Reno had graduated from West Point before GAC entered the academy. If GAC had not been allowed to command the 7th against the Sioux Reno would have been in command. After he had had a few too many, which was often, it is not hard to imagine Reno venting his resentment at serving under an officer junior to him aqnd cursing his, Reno's, luck. Benteen, like GAC, had a distinguished record in the Civil War. The best offer he could get in the post war army was a majority in the 10th Cavalry, which he declined not wanting to serve with blacks. He was also not a West Point officer which most likely led him to believe that this was held against him causing him to resent those who were. He also believed that GAC had left a friend of Benteen's to be killed with his detachment at the Battle of Washita and feared GAC would do the same to him at LBH. Like Reno, Benteen most likely thought he was GAC's equal, if not superior, as an officer. This would make an interesting case study in a work exploring command relationships and the role jealousy and envy have played. Other examples off the top of my head, Grant and Halleck, Patton and Bradley, MacArthur and Marshall, and Winfield Scott Schley and William Sampson both of whom claimed credit for victory at the Battle of Santiago during the Spanish-American War. Feel free to name others. I personally observed some of this during Desert Shield/Storm. Several senior officers were not happy with the CENTCOM commander. They weren't happy campers but they were professionals, which is more than can be said for Reno and Benteen when push came to shove. GAC was a victim of the personnel policies of the time which kept an officer in a unit, in many cases, until he was killed or retired. You have to wonder what would have happened if these 2 had been on detached service and those who were detached had been at the LGH. Just a thought.

 

Don

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memphismeister
If one ever wonders about Custer's military savy, just look at how he personally led four Regiments of Michigan Cavalry against Jeb Stuart's whole Cavalry Corp east of Gettysburg and "whooped' them soundly. Had he not carried the day then, the Gettysburg battle likely would have had a different outcome. As for his Indian tactics, Up until that point of time when U.S. Troops engaged them, the Indians would always scatter in all directions making it impossible to deal a crippling blow. They would later reunite to keep their tribes intact. At the LBH, Custer's surprise along with the vision Sitting Bull had about the coming battle, and the massive Indian alliance that had been formed all led to George's defeat.

 

I have seen good copies of the print range between $1,700.00 to $2,200.00 on the net. You are one lucky guy to have an original

 

:thumbsup:

 

Greg

 

Ummmmm Whooping did not occur.

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Greg Sebring
I had not thought about the role jealousy and envy plays in military affairs. It doesn't take long when reading about Custer and the LBH battle to find out the 7th Cavalry was not a happy band of brothers, but was basically divided into 3 groups, friends and family of GAC, officers unfriendly to GAC, and the rest just trying to get along with the other 2 groups. GAC was 36 years of age in 1876. In today's army that would be about right for a lieutenant colonel. GAC had already been a LtC for 10 years which could not have set well with many other officers. Maj Reno had graduated from West Point before GAC entered the academy. If GAC had not been allowed to command the 7th against the Sioux Reno would have been in command. After he had had a few too many, which was often, it is not hard to imagine Reno venting his resentment at serving under an officer junior to him aqnd cursing his, Reno's, luck. Benteen, like GAC, had a distinguished record in the Civil War. The best offer he could get in the post war army was a majority in the 10th Cavalry, which he declined not wanting to serve with blacks. He was also not a West Point officer which most likely led him to believe that this was held against him causing him to resent those who were. He also believed that GAC had left a friend of Benteen's to be killed with his detachment at the Battle of Washita and feared GAC would do the same to him at LBH. Like Reno, Benteen most likely thought he was GAC's equal, if not superior, as an officer. This would make an interesting case study in a work exploring command relationships and the role jealousy and envy have played. Other examples off the top of my head, Grant and Halleck, Patton and Bradley, MacArthur and Marshall, and Winfield Scott Schley and William Sampson both of whom claimed credit for victory at the Battle of Santiago during the Spanish-American War. Feel free to name others. I personally observed some of this during Desert Shield/Storm. Several senior officers were not happy with the CENTCOM commander. They weren't happy campers but they were professionals, which is more than can be said for Reno and Benteen when push came to shove. GAC was a victim of the personnel policies of the time which kept an officer in a unit, in many cases, until he was killed or retired. You have to wonder what would have happened if these 2 had been on detached service and those who were detached had been at the LGH. Just a thought.

 

Don

 

Don,

 

You have done your homework well and it is a pleasure to read the comments from others who have studied the complete picture.

 

 

 

Greg

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I concur. After reading Nathaniel Philbricks' "The Last Stand", and refreshing my memory on the events of June 25th 1876 I give Custer more credit as a leader. Howsomever, whether the addition of Benteens battalion, 131 men. And the pack train, 120 troopers, would have pulled Custer out of the fire is an unknown factor. Assuredly Capt. Benteen could have got off his rump and went down towards the river and Custer. But would he also not have been defeated in detail? And then Maj. Reno after him? No one will ever know.

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Couple of years ago me and a buddy rode motorcycles to Montanna and through the Battle Field.If you have the chance to see it,is time well spent.The vastness of the terrain and lack of cover can only be seen first hand and you realize there was no where to go.There are draws and depressions but nothing to fortify and the river is quite a ways a way from the fighting positions.I had read about the lack of water the troops faced but being there put it in a real perspective for me.I had to wonder also if Custer had the galtings if they would have made a differance overall in the end??

 

RD

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browningautorifle

Having done a great deal of time in the infantry myself and having been to the battlefield about three separate times, I'm not sure Custer could have overcome the Indians with a modern infantry platoons' TO and E. Just too many enemy and not a good place.

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rufus_firefly

A few what ifs and other thoughts. What if GAC had led the 1st attack on the village instead of Maj Reno and had, instead, sent the Maj to the other end of the village? The point to ponder here is that it is hard to imagine GAC halting his attack, dismounting, and forming a skirmish line. GAC most likely expected Reno to do as he would have done, lead an all-out attack. GAC's battle plan was based on this happening and it didn't. Was GAC ever aware of this, and if so did he compensate for it? A good plot for a work of historical fiction perhaps.

 

What if Capt Benteen had continued on to GAC instead of staying with Maj Reno? The common consensus has always seemed to be that Benteen would have shared GAC's fate. However, there are several factors to consider. First, the Indians were not a trained, organized military force. They fought as individuals for individual glory. When they turned their attention from Reno to GAC none of them seems to have worried about a threat coming from Reno. They were unaware of Benteen's existance. For all practical purposes the entire force which had been attacking Reno went after GAC, turning their backs on a threat from the south. If Benteen had pressed his advance to GAC it is entirely possible that he would have attacked the rear of an unsuspecting foe. It takes a very well-trained unit led by very capable leaders to adjust quickly to such an unpleasant turn of events. Even then there will be a window of opportunity to take advantage of while the enemy adjusts and reorganizes. Benteen may have been able to take advantage of the situation and reach GAC, giving GAC time to reorganize and reconsider his situation.

 

What if GAC had accepted the offer of the Gatling guns when offered them? The offer was declined because GAC thought that the guns would have hampered his movements. In the event they would probably not have slowed him down any more than his pack train did. It should be remembered that in 1876 there was no accepted doctrine for the employment of Gatling guns. It is most likely that they would have traveled with the pack train, ignored and forgotten, arriving with the mules on Reno hill. There they would have been of some use on the 2nd day during the siege, at least until the gunners were picked off as they stood in the open operating their pieces. It is hard to imagine GAC taking them with him on his move to the far end of the village. To him they must have been a weapon of no proven worth that could only have slowed him down when rapid movement was a must.

 

At the end of the first day there were 3 things which could have been done, which in retrospect seem obvious, but which, in fact, did not happen. First, there was no organized effort to secure water. Second, no one was sent north to look for GAC, and third, no one was sent to Gen Terry to inform him of the situation. The Indians withdrew to their camp for the night leaving the 7th cavalry a window of opportunity for such actions. To understand why this happened the way it did remember the 7th had been traveling for several days with little sleep, little water, and eating hardtack and bacon when they could at irregular intervals. They had survived the most stressful day of their lives, running on pure adrenaline. The shock of the day's events, combined with the end of the adrenaline rush, had to have made all thought, except for the most immediate concerns, impossible. Of the two who should have coordinated that nights activities, one, Benteen, was asleep, and the other, Reno, was making sure that his supply of whiskey would not fall into the enemies' hands.

 

What if the 7th had been armed with modern weapons? Given the low state of training in general, and weapons training in particular, they would have most likely have fired off their basic load on full auto at the first opportunity and then been overrun before they could resupply.

 

Finally, if this painting were done today, would not the artist have followed the modern practice of product placement and showed at least one trooper enjoying his last bottle of Bud? Like so much else about this battle we will never know.

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This is an interesting account of the Crow (or Absaloke) scouts who served with GAC and Reno:

 

http://www.astonisher.com/archives/museum/...s_big_horn.html

 

I have been a guest and house guest of the Crow people at Agency and nearby, and took my one and only sweat bath just a few feet from the LBH river on the invitation of and alone with Pretty Elk (a direct descendant of Thomas Yellow Tail), whose wife served as a curator and guide at the battle monument for many years.

 

To hear their version of events is enlightening. In all, for the better part, they remain quite deferential to the 7th Cavalry.

post-3976-1302622323.jpg

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